TDV6 2.7. Engine not start after fording

[Chilly]

Hi all,
Looking for some help.
Got stuck in a long puddle today. Bellied out. Car never stopped running. Pulled out backwards. Drove off and parked up 100 metres away to allow water out of car. (I was in the puddle for a while). Engine not stopped. Drove off up hill and engined died. Unable to restart. Quite a lot of faults came up. Have cleared but cannot restart. Thoughts? Ideas?

The fan has bits broken off. Unable to see any water on the dipstick. Signs of slight whiteness in cap!!

Appreciate any advice

Thanks
Chilly

[Graeme]

Can you recall the faults as knowing them might help identify what got wet.

[Chilly]

Quite a few....would of saved them but took my card out the other day for some reprogramming.

[Chilly]

Just got flat bedded home. Raining here and battery low. Will charge up and see what codes are recorded. Did start once but sounded very sickly and noisy!!

[Chilly]

Current Fault Codes.

FAULT 1 OF 21
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0102
Lost communication with transfer case control module
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 2 OF 21
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0132
Lost communication with ride level ctrl module / Lost communication with suspension ctrl module A
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 3 OF 21
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0138
Lost communication with all terrain control module
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 4 OF 21
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:U0184
Lost communication with audio unit
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 5 OF 21
ECU: Instrument Pack
CODE:B1A87
Battery disconnection/electronic control unit reset
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 6 OF 21
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P0405
Exhaust gas recirculation sensor A - circuit low
(HISTORIC)

FAULT 7 OF 21
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P1621
Immobilizer code words do not match
(PENDING)

FAULT 8 OF 21
ECU: Engine Management
CODE:P0622
Generator field terminal circuit
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 9 OF 21
ECU: Transfer Case
CODE:P0562
System voltage low
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 10 OF 21
ECU: Automatic Gearbox
CODE:U0155
Lost communication with instrument cluster control module

FAULT 11 OF 21
ECU: Parking Brake
CODE:U0155
Lost communication with instrument cluster control module
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 12 OF 21
ECU: Parking Brake
CODE:U0122
Lost communication with vehicle dynamics control module
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 13 OF 21
ECU: Parking Brake
CODE:C1A00
Control module
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 14 OF 21
ECU: Ride Level
CODE:U0416
Invalid data received from vehicle dynamics control module
(PENDING)

FAULT 15 OF 21
ECU: Steering Angle Sensor
CODE:U0300
Internal control module software incompatibility
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 16 OF 21
ECU: Airbags/SRS
CODE:B1A00
Control module
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 17 OF 21
ECU: Body Control
CODE:U2001
Reduced system function
(PERMANENT)

FAULT 18 OF 21
ECU: HVAC system
CODE:B1B74
Front foot-defrost mode stepper actuator
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 19 OF 21
ECU: HVAC system
CODE:B1B75
Front foot-face mode stepper actuator
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 20 OF 21
ECU: HVAC system
CODE:B1B76
Front left air blend stepper actuator
(INTERMITTENT)

FAULT 21 OF 21
ECU: HVAC system
CODE:B1B77
Front right air blend stepper actuator
(INTERMITTENT)

[Oztourer]

How high did the water get in the car? I'm not sure where they are all positioned but maybe an ECU got flooded. Good luck with it.

[Chilly]

The water was high externally. But only trickled in on the passengers side. Until tow out. Water never more than a very low small puddle on the floor.

Engine area seemed dry!

[Chilly]

Man, every time I go out to look it pours down.
Wiring and Ecu around battery appear dry. Lifted fuse box and maybe signs of water there...hard to see and started to pour again.

[DazzaTD5]

My obvious thought there is prolly some blown fuses (on the passenger side behind the glovebox), but the below fault will bring up a whole list of what seems unrelated faults as you have listed.

This is a common fault on the D3/early RRS.
"Lost communication with transfer case control module"
When the Transfer Case Control Module gets wet, (pressure cleaning engine bay, water crossings, body seals above failing) eventually it shorts a circuit on the pcb (the computer board), its behind the battery, behind a plastic cover.

When I replace them (round $600 from memory) I open the aluminum housing and waterproof the board with circuit board lacquer, then seal the alum case joints with sealant, finally use rubber grease on the seal for the plastic cover. Spray the whole lot with waterproofing.

The transfer case control module needs to be initialized/calibrated before it will function again. but the vehicle can be driven as a manual, as in use in sports mode and change gears, it will up-shift as you shift, but do be careful as it will also down shift as you shift, meaning it will go down into gears at speeds it prolly shouldnt.

Thats where I would start...

Regards
Daz

[LandyAndy]

From Gordons GOE seminar,you need to check/clean the connections at the air-compressor and above the rear strut(cant remember if its on the left or right hand side.
The tranny/transfer ecu was the other location,you are already onto that one adj to the battery.
GOODLUCK.
Andrew

[Chilly]

My obvious thought there is prolly some blown fuses (on the passenger side behind the glovebox), but the below fault will bring up a whole list of what seems unrelated faults as you have listed.

This is a common fault on the D3/early RRS.
"Lost communication with transfer case control module"
When the Transfer Case Control Module gets wet, (pressure cleaning engine bay, water crossings, body seals above failing) eventually it shorts a circuit on the pcb (the computer board), its behind the battery, behind a plastic cover.

When I replace them (round $600 from memory) I open the aluminum housing and waterproof the board with circuit board lacquer, then seal the alum case joints with sealant, finally use rubber grease on the seal for the plastic cover. Spray the whole lot with waterproofing.

The transfer case control module needs to be initialized/calibrated before it will function again. but the vehicle can be driven as a manual, as in use in sports mode and change gears, it will up-shift as you shift, but do be careful as it will also down shift as you shift, meaning it will go down into gears at speeds it prolly shouldnt.

Thats where I would start...

Regards
Daz

The ecu behind the battery appears dry...very dry dust. Do you mean a controller on the transfer itself?

Have seen water in the bottom of the engine bay fuse box. One wire hanging down with a connection was damp...cleaned this out with water dispellant.

[Chilly]

From Gordons GOE seminar,you need to check/clean the connections at the air-compressor and above the rear strut(cant remember if its on the left or right hand side.
The tranny/transfer ecu was the other location,you are already onto that one adj to the battery.
GOODLUCK.
Andrew

Hi Andrew,
Great information too. I'll have a look at the air compressor etc.....when/if it stops raining.
Thanks

[Graeme]

Do you mean a controller on the transfer itself?

Have seen water in the bottom of the engine bay fuse box.No, its in the vicinity of the engine bay fuse box and battery.
Water in the engine bay fuse box is not a good sign.

[SBD4]

Given that water got into the car and that the car only had issues once you began driving uphill, I would hazard a guess that you may have issues with water getting into connectors at he rear of the of the vehicle.

I would suggest you lift the carpet at the doors and check that the channels that house the front to rear wiring (including canbus wires) to make sure it is dry.

Work your way to the back of the vehicle making sure all connectors (if any) are dry.

[BobD]

Have you got a snorkel and have you checked the air box to see if there is any water in there or the filter is wet?


It is possible that there was water in the air box and when you accelerated it was sucked into the engine, whereas it was OK while idling with little air flow.

[Chilly]

Have you got a snorkel and have you checked the air box to see if there is any water in there or the filter is wet?


It is possible that there was water in the air box and when you accelerated it was sucked into the engine, whereas it was OK while idling with little air flow.

Air filter was damp but not wet/soaked. no signs of water in any housing after filter. I do have a RAI fitted.

[TerryO]

Sounds like you have multiple issues, if you have water past the air filter, which it sounds like you do, then your likely to have issues with injectors. I take it your RAI snorkel had not been water proofed?

It doesn't take a lot of water to partially block injectors, if your filter has moisture in it and your running the engine then your sucking what ever moisture is in the filter through it and into the engine via the injectors.

Water in electricals is more likely to stop the engine from running at all, not just run rough.

Anyway good luck with it and I hope it's not injectors.

[rar110]

Water up to the side air in take? That's quite deep.

As said earlier. Lift the sill plates and feel inside the cavity for dampness, particularly if you sat in water for a while.

[Graeme]

if your filter has moisture in it and your running the engine then your sucking what ever moisture is in the filter through it and into the engine via the injectors.Late night Terry? Only if water in the fuel.

[rar110]

Late night Terry? Only if water in the fuel.

I assumed that's what he meant.

[Graeme]

Perhaps he did!

[BobD]

Graeme, do you know if the 2.7 has any sort of protection that would cut out the engine if it detects water in the inlet?

[Graeme]

I do not know of any such device fitted to any of the 2.7, the 3.0, the 3.6 and the 4.4. .

My initial thought was a dead TCCM as already suggested due to the raft of can-bus faults including loss of contact with the TCCM and that a dead TCCM isolates a whole stack of other modules due to being a can-bus gateway. However IIRC the BCU is part of the engine bay fuse box so could be that module.

[BobD]

Did start once but sounded very sickly and noisy!!


The fact that it stopped suddenly and then later started and was noisy worried me, especially after possibly ingesting a small amount of water.

[TerryO]

Late night Terry? Only if water in the fuel.


Graeme, nope actually I had a early night, so no excuses there, I don't mind admitting I had a major brain when I wrote what I did. ... Doh! ... :angel:

[Chilly]

The fact that it stopped suddenly and then later started and was noisy worried me, especially after possibly ingesting a small amount of water.

me too!!

Well, removed sill covers etc today. Lots of water in the wire loom area. Dried out. Cannot see any in the inside fuse box area.

One Plug behind the battery low down was wet. Pulled apart and spray out with water Dispellant. Left open to dry.

Will do some more later today. Check some more wires and connectors as suggested on here.

The air filter was damp on one side only. The other was bone dry.

Yes, in very deep.

[TerryO]

For what it's worth about six months ago I had the passenger side sill and front foot well full of water for several days from a busted sunroof drain pipe. It took that amount of time to dry it out even with a wet and dry vacuum cleaner and lifted carpets. Maybe I was just lucky but from my experience even though the loom was under water all of that time it didn't cause any issues.

[Redback]

I'm assuming it's a D3, water in the BCU was common on the D3, hence why they moved it to the other side of the engine bay, I'm also assuming there is supposedly more protection from water ingress over there.

[Chilly]

Hi Redback,

Which one is the bcu?

[Redback]

Hi Redback,

Which one is the bcu?

Actually I may have that wrong, I think it's the transfer case ECU not the BCU that they moved, apparently where it sat in the D3 wasn't good and was more susceptible to water ingress.

But I would imagine if there is water in your fuse bax un the bonnet, then as said the BCU could also be affected as it's nearby.

[DazzaTD5]

The ecu behind the battery appears dry...very dry dust. Do you mean a controller on the transfer itself?

Have seen water in the bottom of the engine bay fuse box. One wire hanging down with a connection was damp...cleaned this out with water dispellant.

No, not the solenoid on the actual transfer case, I mean the Transfer Case Control Module (Integrated Transfer Case Module), its the first small alloy box behind the battery, behind a plastic cover. You need to remove it and open it to inspect for any damage, the two issues with it are the alloy case its in isnt waterproof or even resistant to water and the module sits plug facing up, another poor idea. If you look at the pic, while a bit hard to see you can make out a number of burnt tracks and corrosion on the PCB (printed circuit board).

On the Discovery 4 they moved it to the passenger side of the engine bay, it sits higher, is plug down, has a full plastic cover (but still not waterproof) and prolly a bit safer.


Regards
Daz

[Chilly]

Hi Daz,

Yes I have found that one. Pulled it apart and can see no water ingress. Ecu was dusty dry apart from small stain at bottom....not near the circuit board. Can see no damage to board. Have purchase circuit board spray and sprayed board.

Plug near this behind battery was wet. Spray with water displacement spray and left to dry.

Put back together just now.

Engine fired up!! Hooray!

Left to idle. Alt light on...when getting warm oil light came on....switched off!

Checked faults....lots off.

Cleared and restarted. Oil light off, alt light off....still lights of faults. Alt light back on.

Have to park for now as time for work.

Guessing I have some plugs to pull apart and clean. Starting with alt plug.

Would appreciate advise on which other plugs/connectors to do.

Thanks all for help....hopefully seeing some light out of the woods....fingers crossed etc

Chilly

[LRD414]

Left to idle. Alt light on...when getting warm oil light came on....switched off!
Cleared and restarted. Oil light off, alt light off....still lights of faults. Alt light back on.
How did it sound when starting and running/idling?

Scott

[Chilly]

Not rsttling or kn9cking.....was listening for engine problems to be ready to switch off. D8d restart and oil light wss off but only ran for 30 40 seconds. Then had to go to work. Hoping it is a watrr in pliug r cionnectiion tythrowing the lights on. Will retry tomorrow

[Disco-tastic]

Can I ask a favour chilly (or anyone who knows) - can you please write a list of all the sensors and connections that had water in them? I just bought a D3 and plan to waterproof as much of those as I can, starting with those more susceptible.

My apologies if this information is elsewhere on the forum.

Cheers

Dan

[Chilly]

Can I ask a favour chilly (or anyone who knows) - can you please write a list of all the sensors and connections that had water in them? I just bought a D3 and plan to waterproof as much of those as I can, starting with those more susceptible.

My apologies if this information is elsewhere on the forum.

Cheers

Dan

A good idea...but for after I have it fixed.
Prioritising on fixing first.due to this being a big concern....like all....cannot afford a dead car...or the potential of costs to fix...like new engine...or several ecu's etc....when I have destressed....then I'll try to put something together.

[Chilly]

Home tonight and realised the car is blocking everyone getting their garbage emptying.....so....took the risk of starting and moving around the street on to my property.....all successfully done.

Alt light still on...so I'll look at this tomorrow. Will also look at connectors abovair compressor.

Will reset faults and sees what comes up and post on here.

Anyway of removing dash around inside fuse box...for ease of viewing etc.

O...will also check for any blown fuses.

Thanks for the support from the forum....very much appreciated at a time of dep concern for my loved Disco.

Chilly

[Graeme]

The connectors above the suspension compressor are water-proof and can't cause the errors that are occurring anyway. I would concentrate on the engine bay fuse panel which can be unbolted for drying access underneath - just don't stress the wiring unnecessarily.

[DazzaTD5]

Apart from the Transfer Case control module (which still maybe a fault, you dont know unless you get into electronics parts checking on the board, there nothing to say that one of the components hasnt failed on the board).

The other obvious D3 thing is the earth points.
*Inside cabin, bottom of A pillars, both sides, remove the plastic side kick panel as well as the flat panel that runs on the inside bottom of the door opening.
*You will find earth points on both side, undo, clean, tighten up.

*Also there is the harness plug, passenger side engine bay, between engine and the plastic battery compartment, i think its clipped onto the outside of the plastic compartment.

*On later D3's (after that first 2005/6 model) there are the main harness plugs on each side of the inner front wheel arch, you need to remove the inner guard plastic liner and you will see them towards the bottom of the firewall.

*There is also the harness plugs at the rear passenger side inner guard, can be accessed without removing inner liner, sits just behind the airbag, there is a vertical plastic panel that clips downwards, sometimes the clips break, but after when you fold it back up a large zip tie will hold it in place neatly.

*There is all the harness plugs at the back by the tail light assemblies, which who knows if thats giving issues, I wouldnt have thought so though.

Thats about all I can think of.....

Regards
Daz

[Scouse]

Alt light still on...so I'll look at this tomorrow. Will also look at connectors abovair compressor.

From my warranty claim days, TDV6 alternators don't really like being dunked in water so it could well be the alternator itself if all the connections appear OK.

[Chilly]

Ok...replaced oil and filter. Oil light still comes on.

Have purchased a oil pressure tester and get these results.

Idle 4-5 psi
2000-2500 rpm. 10 psi.

Which seems way too low. Will do some research too get actual specs.

What is people thoughts?

Stuffed engine?
Oil pump failure?
Do they have a pressure relief valve that can fail?

Chilly

[Chilly]

Ok.
Pulled all covers off underneath before going to work. Just checked on arrival home and can see oil coming out the front....guessing crank seal in the dark....this would allow low oil pressure.

Will clean area and strip things down tomorrow.

What do you think to it being the Crank seal?


Thinking it's got a bit of water in this way....poss crank damage?

A lot of money to fork out on pump and belts,(timing belt is fast approaching age and kms),

Hmmm.....need to sleep on this and think a bit clearer.

Night
Chilly

[Scouse]

A leaking seal isn't going to cause low oil pressure. If it's leaking very badly, it may indicate something behind the seal has damaged it though.

[Chilly]

Aye,

My thinking is the water/mud has been forced in with water. This causing an issue. With this being the location of the oil pump perhaps leaking externally as well s pumping up.....

[LandyAndy]

Rapid cooling of any mechanical component in the drive train will cause the suction of air,or water if its under water from the easiest source.Im guessing these engines are air tight for pollution control,it may be that your crank seal was worn and allowed the cooled of engine to suck water in thru the seal.Any grime allowed in would quickly chew into the seal to make it leak.
The oil pressure is a worry.
GOODLUCK
Andrew

[LandyAndy]

Could be worth contacting Dondownunder.He mentioned the other day he has his expired engine for sale at a low cost for anybody that is interested.
Andrew

[Chilly]

Could be worth contacting Dondownunder.He mentioned the other day he has his expired engine for sale at a low cost for anybody that is interested.
Andrew

Hi Andrew,

Thanks for that. I have replied to his market advert. Being 2200 I don't wish to ring incase he is asleep.

Thanks,

Chilly

[Chilly]

Aye, the oil pressure is a concern. Spent Sat removing all the mud from...well just about everywhere!!
Been raining since. Hopefully I will get a look after work tomorrow.

[LandyAndy]

Almost 7pm in wait awilst:p:p:p:p:p:p
Andrew

[Chilly]

ok...pulled the oil filter off and had a look at the oil....hmmm...not good...can see shiny bits in it....its an engine out and rebuild.

BUMMER!!

Thanks all for your help!


Chilly

[Chilly]

Could be worth contacting Dondownunder.He mentioned the other day he has his expired engine for sale at a low cost for anybody that is interested.
Andrew

I have spoken to him this morning....have agreed to buy and will pick up next week....

Thanks

[LandyAndy]

ok...pulled the oil filter off and had a look at the oil....hmmm...not good...can see shiny bits in it....its an engine out and rebuild.

BUMMER!!

Thanks all for your help!


Chilly

Will be very interesting to find out what has happened here:(:(:(:(:(
Andrew

[Narangga]

Yes it will Andy.

Sorry to hear it came to that Chilly.