Help with a dead Defender

[Footnote10]

Just got back into a TD5 defender after a dry spell bought a project car described as needing a new engine MY2000 with 173k...
head was dud so decided to do a complete engine swap with a known good engine from a rusty D2 auto...
So...

swap went fine with The engine slotting in nicely but now can’t get it started...

I know the engine is good as I had it running just before taking it out so am ruling out anything on the engine...

I have not recoded injectors as I don’t have access to a scan tool which works (yet?🙄🙄) but I’m told this won’t stop it starting so I’m carrying on regardless

things I have tried to date

retraced the fuel lines
changed fuel filter and bleed valve
changed MAF and the crank sensor with known good units (from the running D2) wrapped crank wiring in alifoil for better shielding
Cleaned the ECU connectors (no oil showing up anyway..) it’s got power as dash lights all up
charged battery and tested 13v no issues and is turning it over fine..
checked and tested the fuel cut switch on bulkhead...
run the bleed cycle around 20 times.. only sound other than the pump is a peeing from inside the cooler which I’ve heard on others and doesn’t appear abnormal...
charged battery again.....
checked fuel pressure at regulator 5 bar...
checked and run an earth from engine to bulkhead.. :soapbox::soapbox::soapbox:

there are 2 thinks I am suspect about...

the bonnet close switch broke the terminal off and this is now earthed (as I think it works when the bonnet presses it down...)


the only other thing I can see is the radio code is requested from the OEM radio (tapedeck) when pos 1 on key is set.. a couple of presses and I can get this to play music (despite not having code) but when cranking the engine the radio “red light” on the top left corner is flashing - is this immobiliser?? I thought this was on the dash cluster and nothing shows there... I don’t have any fobs just the bare key recieved from previous owner who never suggested a fob was needed and it’s not central locking so unsure on how the immobiliser function can be checked or disarmed if this is the case... TD5’s are hard programmed into the ECU I think... fuel pump is running and cranking sees diesel smoke out the auspuffer so looks like injectors are firing...

any suggestions???

I’m getting flack from the little lady after spending Easter trying unsuccessfully to romance the def..so have to hear it running sooner rather than later.. I must be missing something simple but it’s kickin my xa$#! She’s suggesting I should use it as a boat anchors so honour must be preserved!!!

[Standard]

A few years ago, I replaced the failed MSB ecu in my 1999 130 with a chipped one from TRS, and it would not fire until the injector codes were changed.

[Gumnut]

Hi,
The injector coding should not stop it firing and running.
On the other hand, if it is immobilised, you could crank it from now to Christmas with no joy...
I have found a good scan tool (I use nanocom) to be essential with D2 TD5..... And it will tell you if it is immobilised.
Cheers,
Gumnut

[DazzaTD5]

I'd suggest before you start touching every possible item that may or may not prevent the truck from starting...

*So you have done the depress throttle 5 times with ignition on, left it to do its thing.
*Then with a charged battery, hold throttle to floor, crank, crank crank for what seems a lifetime, then as it starts to splutter, bring throttle about half way up, while still cranking, until it comes to life. There will be lots of white smoke.

other things to note.
*The replacement engine was known to be running by you?
*Was it all starting before you removed old engine?

*Non coded injectors wont stop it from starting or running, it's idle may not be perfect is all.
*Bonnet switch wont stop it from starting

[DazzaTD5]

A few years ago, I replaced the failed MSB ecu in my 1999 130 with a chipped one from TRS, and it would not fire until the injector codes were changed.

No, what prevented it from starting likely was the engine computer hadnt been sync'd with the bcm.

[DazzaTD5]

TD5’s are hard programmed into the ECU I think... fuel pump is running and cranking sees diesel smoke out the auspuffer so looks like injectors are firing...




No they arent, the Nanocom can disable the immobiliser (said in a general end point).

It actually sounds like its already trying to start

[Footnote10]

So in answer
Yes the donor D2 ran and heard it myself before taking out the engine...
The bleed (5times throttle) has been done multiple times and I’ve cranked till battery tires (3 sets of 20 seconds - stinky white smoke out the back so I assume diesel making it through injectors...
still using the original defender ECU so didn’t expect any reprogram other than injectors (have bought an early Hawkeye but cable is u/s so can’t read.. all my other scan tools not reading...)

[Footnote10]

The white smoke has made an appearance for a number of tries but doesn’t seem to catch for more than a second then dies off.. will do the depressed 5 and crank a few more times tonight and report back thanks in advance for all suggestions

[Blknight.aus]

check the plumbing for the fuel hoses, if you got them backwards or ass about on the filter/tank you'll get this issue.

to really prime it up find the fuel pump relay and bridge it out, keep the battery on a charger and let it sit for about 5 minutes. leave it bridged and then do the hold it pinned and crank it (I advise cranking it without the throttle pinned until it gets oil pressure then going again)

some also checks are the glow plug circuit and relay
the prang stop button is reset properly

[Footnote10]

check the plumbing for the fuel hoses, if you got them backwards or ass about on the filter/tank you'll get this issue.

to really prime it up find the fuel pump relay and bridge it out, keep the battery on a charger and let it sit for about 5 minutes. leave it bridged and then do the hold it pinned and crank it (I advise cranking it without the throttle pinned until it gets oil pressure then going again)

like the bypass idea will give it a shot...

some also checks are the glow plug circuit and relay
the prang stop button is reset properly

lve run through the pipes and all agrees with LR service manual it’s also been press. tested at the regulator with 5+ bar after a couple of efforts it’s chucking enough diesel out the back to start the neighbours yard..
glow plug circuit is working checked👍
prang stop button also checked.. and bypassed just for the sake of it...

im seriously suspecting the immobiliser has kicked in.. got a call in with LR for an EKA code as I didn’t get a plip fob as never needed before according to last owner... I’m hoping it’s that...

anyone got a nanocom they are looking to get rid of?...I can see one in my future🤨 I’ve got a spare TD5 engine to trade🤣

[slug_burner]

lve run through the pipes and all agrees with LR service manual it’s also been press. tested at the regulator with 5+ bar after a couple of efforts it’s chucking enough diesel out the back to start the neighbours yard..
glow plug circuit is working checked👍
prang stop button also checked.. and bypassed just for the sake of it...

im seriously suspecting the immobiliser has kicked in.. got a call in with LR for an EKA code as I didn’t get a plip fob as never needed before according to last owner... I’m hoping it’s that...

anyone got a nanocom they are looking to get rid of?...I can see one in my future🤨 I’ve got a spare TD5 engine to trade🤣

Surely to stop a Diesel engine from firing via immobiliser, it has to stop the fuel getting to the cylinder. Therefore I don’t think the engine has been immobilised. There has to be something else not right. Air supply? Correct timing? Enough fuel?

Fuel pressure with engine stopped or at idle doesn’t mean much. Once the engine picks up revs the pressure will drop unless the pump in the tank can keep up the supply. If the hoses are not connected correctly or a crimped you could be choking the the fuel pump.That is were the fuel connection points could could be playing a part.

Interesting problem. Hope a scan tool helps.

[Discofender]

CKP?? Crank Position Sensor, did you check this when changing the engine? Maybe fuel injection timing is out because of it.
Is ECM giving rpm when cranking (if you have a tacho fitted), a nanocom will also tell you.

[Footnote10]

Surely to stop a Diesel engine from firing via immobiliser, it has to stop the fuel getting to the cylinder. Therefore I don’t think the engine has been immobilised. There has to be something else not right. Air supply? Correct timing? Enough fuel?

Fuel pressure with engine stopped or at idle doesn’t mean much. Once the engine picks up revs the pressure will drop unless the pump in the tank can keep up the supply. If the hoses are not connected correctly or a crimped you could be choking the the fuel pump.That is were the fuel connection points could could be playing a part.

Interesting problem. Hope a scan tool helps.

Air is clear as new filter and MAF fitted
timing also ruled out as the engine swap,was with a good engine heard running and starting prior to fitting in this defender...

good news is I’ve sourced a nanocom so should at least be able to get some live data off the ecm in next week...

the pressure checked using a gauge off the fuel temp port at the regulator as it’s an electronic pump I understood these run at constant pressure and the injectors take the required at higher revs...

you are right about the immobiliser - I ruled that out as got the EKA code and entered it with no change..

tomorrow checking the CPS wiring and the fuses (again) also saw a resistance test in YouTube to verify the CPS although it’s been tried on the one I got out of the doner disco.. that started it fine so I’d given it the ok... doesn’t hurt to check...

ive never been good at electrics guess I’mmgoing to have to improve!!!

[Footnote10]

CKP?? Crank Position Sensor, did you check this when changing the engine? Maybe fuel injection timing is out because of it.
Is ECM giving rpm when cranking (if you have a tacho fitted), a nanocom will also tell you.

I tried the donor vehicle CPS as one of first things... doesn’t have a taco so can only do basic checks - revisiting the wiring checks tomorrow as a precaution

[Footnote10]

Just an update so pulled the fuel cooler out and did continuity on the CPS wires.. I did note a bit of oil down the connector so checked ecu internals (clean) have cleaned out the connector blocks and the ecu terminals with brake cleaner..

just to protect my sanity can I get a confirm on my plumbing at the reg side

fuel line from high pressure pump side to upper reg connection line out to left hand cooler connection as seen from drivers side. Rh cooler connection to filter return front right of the 4 connection point on filter housing (chassis side the back for handing

[Mellow Yellow]

If the earth for the ECM is loose this will stop the engine starting.

[Footnote10]

Nanocom turned up and am installing code so hope to get to the bottom of this in next couple of days....

[Footnote10]

Hi all,
so got a nanocom thanks Rexreute for the quick sending...

the cps is working fine, as are the throttle pedal etc.. the MAF and other critical sensors seem ok too...

ive got codes for injector peaks being short 28-1 injector charge peak short same for all 5 cylinders I also have some pretty big cylinder balance no’s -7 to 30 depending on cylinder - starts off all within 9 but then gets worse as cranking continues...

I can only think ECU as I’ve swapped the injector harness for a known good with no change..

im about out of my depth on diagnostics at this point so any suggestions gratefully accepted..