Dazzling new toyota technology

[LandyAndy]

Hows this???
Just read an article about the new 200 Series Landcruiser.
It fitted with an all new suspension system they call KDDS Kenetic Dynamic Suspension System,yep the words dont even matcg the acronym:D:D:D:D
Designed and developed by Kinetic suspensions WA.
Now this BRAND NEW technology giges increased off-road articulation and greatly improved road holding.
HOW IS THIS SO??? Well they have come up with a real clever idea,fit a hydraulic ram to the front and rear stabiliser bars,add a computer to control the pressure applied via the rams to increase/decrease pressure on the stabiliser bars.
WHAT A FANTASTIC BIT OF ENGINEERING.
Ive got it on my 1999 D2,Landrover call it ACE,active cornering enhancment.
WELCOME TO THE MODERN WORLD TOYOTA:D:D:D:D:D
Andrew

[beforethevision]

How about a quick check of google and the kinetics site eh?

It IS actually KDSS, and waaaay fancier than ACE. Also in simplest form, probably more reliable.

Kinetics generally make good ****. Atleast for racing purposes.

The coloured lines are hydraulic.
http://www.kinetic.au.com/images/x.jpg

[mcrover]

I was reading about this in 4wd mags back in about 97.

They have fitted it to Unimogs, Landrovers/Perenti's and Nissan Patrol's (GQ) were the test rigs at the time and they were having trouble with getting a computer system to work as fast as the Hydronumatic system could.

It was pretty amazing what they could do with it but no matter how good technology is when it's new, it will fail eventually as all parts do and it is 1 thing that you cant do without is your suspention.

At least with a coil, worst comes to worse you weld it up and keep the guts off the ground.

Andrew Richmond (LRA) ran a much more crude system in his old orange rangie back in about 2001.

Nothing all that new but just updated Id say.

[1103.9TDI]

I had a similar system fittted to my '87 County when I bought it!; it had a ram on front left and rear right of a special anti-roll bar, that pushed/pulled via a pendulum that opened/closed a hydraulic valve, so as you went around a corner, the pendulum would swing opening one route for the fluid, and closing the other. The system was fed by a separate hydraulic pump/reservoir via the A/C fan belts. It was great for high speed cornering-highway use, but found it too restrictive off-road & removed it. I've seen advertisements in old 4WD mags from the early eighties, for these units, they are definitely nothing new, and were available for any 4x4 of that period!. Apparently they were hideously expensive!.
'ACE'-old technology with a tweak.......probably unrealiable long term.....

[Michael2]

I have an idea -

4 hydraulic rams (1 per wheel) all linked to a common reservoir.

The reservoir itself is a bigger hydraulic ram with a coil spring providing tension (pushing in) to the reservoir ram. The coil spring mounting plate has a screw mechanism which allows for more or less spring tension on the reservoir.

This way the movement of one wheel is partially compensated for by the other three, while the reservoir (larger bore, lower resistance) offers additional dampening and takes the harshness out of any maneuver.

The adjustable spring not only allows for stiffening the suspension, but also for raising it.

Now if only I had the workshop to build it.

[barney]

typical of toyota. copy what LR does about 10 yrs ago and claim it as their own. if compared to LR all they'll say is that what LR came out with was primitive and rudimentary compared to their much improved system.
but i read something interesting in the herald today;-
'Quick' response on Toyota quality issues (http://search.smh.com.au/click.ac?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fnews%2Fne ws%2Fquick-response-on-toyota-quality-issues%2F2007%2F11%2F09%2F1194329476600.html&t=4&n=1&s=toyota) Toyota is "mortified" that its recent quality glitches have tarnished the company's reputation for well-built vehicles. A series of embarrassing quality issues has led to service campaigns to rectify problems in recent months, rocking a company renowned for quality and reliability. good to see some of their many shortcomings are being noticed

[HangOver]

so you mean it gives a bit of a lift via hydraulics
like LR did with pneumatics years ago?
well whoop-de-doo

[JDNSW]

so you mean it gives a bit of a lift via hydraulics
like LR did with pneumatics years ago?
well whoop-de-doo

Or perhaps something like Citroen introduced more than fifty years ago? Maybe their patents have expired.

John

[barney]

no! the hydraulics simply put pressure on the side/corner that wants to dip when cornering to keep the car level. has nothing to do with suspension height.

[discowhite]

no! the hydraulics simply put pressure on the side/corner that wants to dip when cornering to keep the car level. has nothing to do with suspension height.

so dose that mean that there will be no more toymotas driving round like the 100series dragging their front bars on the ground:twisted:

cheers phil

[LandyAndy]

Hi Beforethevision
If I recall that setup you have mentioned was developed on a Defender in WA quite a long time ago,they were trying to sell the system to Landrover for use by the British/Aussie armies.I still have a Landy mag with a article on it.
Unsure if the news article from yesterdays West Australian is available online,but the jurno definately described the system as 2 rams one back one front applying pressure to the stabiliser bars,same as the ACE does.Perhaps the jurno has it all wrong,but seeing he was reporting on the official launch in Alice Springs,Im sure Toyota would have explained the ins and outs of the system to the jurnos.
Andrew

[LandyAndy]

From Toyotas website
http://www.toyota.com.au/toyota/vehicle/Content/0,4664,5103_1912,00.html
Sounds like ACE to me!!!!
Andrew

[chazza]

"The LandCruiser 200 interacts with the road—or whatever you happen to be driving across—like no other vehicle on Earth."

Looks like ACE to me as well Andrew! Apparently like no other vehicle on Earth:clap2:

Cheers Charlie

[2 rocks]

Hey guys
I understand the scepticism, but saw the original version in action back in about '94-'95 - and was the single most impressive thing I've seen in 4 wheel driving. In real terms not really anything like ACE - unless they have had to seriously "dumb" it down for the consumer market.
From memory the test-bed Hilux had suspension arms located in an X pattern and provided flex that was unbelievable. Hope they kept it real!
Cheers
Mike

[Roverwill]

Comon guys, a bit of credit where it's due ;).

The Kinetic system is nothing like Land Rover's clever but complex design. I think in its basic form (I know the company offers different levels of "suspension enhancement") its a reactive mechanical-hydraulic set up and doesn't need sets of pumps, motors, sensors, computers like the Landy stystem. Hopefully that means it will be cheaper, more reliable, easier to repair/service blah, blah, blah.

Bit of a shame Toyota where the only ones smart enough to use the technology, would have been good to see the set up on the new Defender - handle like a demon :twisted: and increase the wheel travel even more :eek:.

Having ranted on, I've never heard much that goes wrong with the Landy's ACE system. Has anyone on the forum ever had any problems :confused:.

- Will

[Frenchie]

It's not the same as the system from Kinetic that gives the huge flex, that replaced the whole suspension with hydraulic rams and was very impressive.

This looke like a good set-up but is hardly new technology.

[rick130]

Mitsubishi and Citroen both used the Kinetic system in their Rallye Raid cars, and I think Citroen might have used it in their WRC cars 'till the FIA outlawed.

[UncleHo]

G'day Folks :)

Kind of looks like a modern version of the old Hydrolastic suspension as fitted to the 1100 & 1800's of the 60's & 70's by Leyland.

cheers