Thread: Airliner chat

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Mt Erebus was mainly a procedural problem. OK, it centered on a data error, but the problem was a combination of how the data got input (organisational failures), plus failure of the flight crew to follow prudent operational procedures (again, largely organisational). No software problems that I know of, although there were navigational limitations - but these were known.

John

It would be hard to blame the pilots for the Erebus crash. They had a waypoint changed (unknown to them) which, instead of leading them down over the flat ice of McMurdo Sound, led them straight into Mt.Erebus. Because of the layer of stratiform cloud hiding the top of the mountain, the featureless white slope of the mountain under the cloud looked just like the featureless flat ice they were expecting to see, and the intersecting line of the cloud on the mountain looked like the distant horizon.

The antics of Air New Zealand in trying to cover up their many errors and failures led to Justice Peter Mahon describing their evidence as "an orchestrated litany of lies".

Stephen.

Absolutely correct Stephen. Captain Collins and his crew acted prudently throughout. It is sad that they are still maligned by those who, despite the irrefutable evidence to the contrary, still believe that he descended below lowest safe in IMC. (Not referring to your comment JD, but to the comments I sometimes hear in the industry) What killed them all was the systemic issue you described, coupled with the lack of contrast in the terrain and the reflection of light between the overcast and the snow. Very sad. The fellow who discovered what actually happened and spent years researching the way that the brain can incorrectly process vision, Gordon Vette, was subsequently incapacitated by a severe stroke but still lives in New Zealand. As a result of the accident and Gordon Vette's work, aviation is much safer now for all. Justice Peter Mahon (who was effectively hounded for telling the truth and died shortly after the Privy Council action), also deserves our thanks for not bending to political and commercial pressure, and perservering in his search for the truth.
I'll get off my hobby horse now.

Round and round the taxiway she goes... when she flys nobody knows!

That must be very frustrating for them. I bet they'd like to do a "howard hughes" and just lift it off a few metres

You might find this site interesting re Erebus

Erebus plane crash disaster story. Air New Zealand flight TE901 crashed at Mt Erebus Antarctica 28 November 1979 > Home

hi all i heard on te news virgin do not do a saftey check before each flight bit of a worry i wont like thinking of that next time work puts me on one cheeers all

Originally Posted by fatcat

hi all i heard on te news virgin do not do a saftey check before each flight bit of a worry i wont like thinking of that next time work puts me on one cheeers all

They must do a prestart each morning though.

Also, the captain should walk around his ship and inspect before each flight for obvious things (might not have helped in this case). It does add new relevance to "kick the tyres, light the fires".

Did anyone hear the pilot union saying it could have crashed the plane? I thought of possible reasons... CG change, front leg failure just before rotation...etc. No, he said he was worried that it could have been sucked one of the jets. That seems very very unlikely to me.