U1700L Unimog in the flesh - HUGE

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Originally Posted by isuzutoo-eh

Nero,
What do you mean by 'umm interesting' referring to the Tatras? Just curious as I know a bloke who has a 4x4 Tatra and want to stir him up.

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They tend to have a few failures to proceed, half way up a steep hill with a load of water on a single lane track seems to be a favourite, most seems to come do to slightly so so electrics on the injection solenoid. See if I can talk to a fitter for a bit next time and get the proper story.

Amazing the amount of information you find on here about Unimogs - a bit of of it is actually true as well :)

I've driven in the $170K Unimog - its a great truck, U1300 modified with about 160-180hp, and a L37 (the very rare long wheelbase) as well. It is a big truck - running massive 14.00R20 (49.5") tyres and can cruise at 100kph. For the record, new Unicats are more than $1.0M.

You can't compare a camper/expo truck where you can live inside it, to something smaller where you live beside it and sleep inside or on top.

I'm busy building my U1250 Unimog into a camper truck - it' basically the "baby" of the Unimog range, being the narrowest, and having the lowest weight for the cab chassis and still being a 7.5 ton truck. I've basically rebuilt the entire brake system, air system, portal axles with high speed gears, fitted an overdrive and a new turbo. Mine will run at 100kph @ 2200rpm. I'm already 2 years into the project. Unimogs are not cheap, but you basically get what you pay for. Spares parts are easy to get, and not expensive if you are prepared to shop overseas. To build your own camper box fully equipped with bed, cupboard, water system, fittings, fridges, stove, solar power, heaters etc will cost you around $60-70K or more. Think how much a decent off road caravan costs and add a fully kitted out Defender to tow it - and it won't get half of the places my Unimog will go.

My U1250 standard only has around 125hp @ 2800rpm. Not enough for a 7.5 ton truck at highway speeds. The new turbo+intercooler and some injector/fuelling mods should get me 160+hp and much more torque throughout the rev range - at least according to the engineers at Honeywell :) I believe that will be enough to let me drive at the speed limit- at least on the flat parts :) The Unimog has coil springs, power steering and disc brakes. I've only driven mine about 50km before pulling it apart and in stock form, but is is real easy to drive.

In stock "military form" it will be rough and noisy. It has no sound insulation ( not much heat insulation either) the seats are very basic - think more series 1 or 2 . It is sprung for the full load of 2.5 tons, and will ride pretty hard empty. All just like the military Land Rovers.:)

In choosing a truck there are two things to remember. First, a camper truck is always going to be heavy - fairly close to the GVM most of the time. That puts it under a lot of stress all the time. Most trucks are not designed to run fully loaded all the time. Second, unless you are particularity wealthy, it's more than likely going to mean buying a second hand truck - and that means it's going to be old and probably well worn.

I wanted a truck for a round the world trip. That means deserts, mud, snow, ice, river crossings etc. These are the trucks I looked at buying

MAN - Made for 1,000,000km of service. They are Chassis are thin on most variants, many reports of engines and transmissions falling out on older expedition trucks. Great off road, mainly due to proper tyres and you can get high power versions. Common choice for expo truck in Europe. Good part service world wide. Very rare - and expensive over here.

FUSO- this was my first choice, however after much research I decided against it. Chassis are very thin - cracks are common, their leaf/cart suspension is rough, and have been known to crack the spring mounts. These are basically good road trucks with 4 wheel drive for occasional off road use. Great for bitumen and dirt roads. Dual rear tyres as standard which are pretty hopeless off road main. Limited tyre choice - 285/75R19.5 are about as big as you can go and I think only Toyo makes off road ones in that size and load rating. Coil spring kits are available, but expensive. Parts difficult to obtain outside outside of target markets of Asia/ Australia

Canter- basically a lighter FUSO, same problems but with a lower GVM in most cases. Same tyre choice as FUSO and similar suspension upgrades available. Problems with springs, brakes, diffs, shock mounts.

HINO - basically a heavy duty FUSO, very rough ride. Better tyre choice available, but this is a big heavy truck and not suitable

OKA - older models reported to have a very rough ride, noisy and hot. Difficult to get parts due to limited production run. New ones are much better, but also $300K+

Mercedes Benz 1017/1617 etc. Great trucks, pretty rare over here unfortunately. Used by the military around the world. Great tyres choice available. Common in Europe for expo trucks, 1017 is a 10ton-170hp, and 1617 is a 16ton-170hp. That's a pretty big truck

Mercedes Benz Unimog (Square Cab models) -probably the best off road truck in the world, used world wide by military, fire and emergency services. Portal axles are both the biggest strength and weakness. Very expensive new - more than $350K for a cab/chassis. Unbelievable tyre choice available, from massive 56" tractors downwards. Older ones will need to be "civilised" for road use. Designed to run fully loaded all the time - basically over engineered in other words. The ones the ADF will be selling from next year are mostly U1700 10ton trucks. Up until recently, the average price was over $60K for an old second hand one. Multiple versions/variants - U1300 being the most common (7.5ton - 130hp) - ADF has U1700 - heavy duty version of the U1300 with 170hp.

Mercedes Benz Unimog (Round Cab and older models) - basically an off-road only truck - very rough, very hot, very noisy, slow etc. Fantastic off road, but painful to drive.

In the end, I got lucky, when mine came up for auction, I put "silly" bid on it and won it. It had a lot of problems, but I'm still much better off than buying a $60K truck and I know how to fix basically everything now, and it's almost as good a new. The last U1250 that came up for sale in Australia cost more than $70K.

Here in the UK I have a 1958 SUMB (a French copy of a MOG) and its immensely fun especially for the $2000 it cost me, but as a tuck is a big step up from my 101. Also it has a petrol V8 in so I cant afford to drive it far :( I am going to sell it before I come over to OZ as its not worth the cost of transporting it but it has been fun to own!

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Originally Posted by 101 Ron

In the army I have driven Mogs when they were just coming into the Aust army system and compared them with the Internationals which they replaced.
They were new and relaible at that time.
Loaded and pulling guns etc the performance of the two different types of vehicles were the same , give and take abit.
I was thinking how 20 years would effect these Mogs with something like 9 vee belts on the front of the motor and diffs which had to be whinched apart to drop out the transmission , or a morse chain steering conversion running under the full lenght of the dash board, or the fact they couldnt be lift towed without spending about 2.5 hours dropping the winch on the front etc.
The army mogs were light years ahead of the internationals in comfort and much easier to drive and have a very good suspension for a load carrying vehicle.
The Ex aussie army mogs are a medium size truck just like the Internationals they replaced.
Any one thinking they are in the landrover class .....forget it.
I recently done afew miles behind the wheel of a S404 Mog
This vehicle is completely different to the aust army ones and shows you must understand what model you need.
It had a 1.5 tonne payload similar to my 101 landrover, but is still amuch bigger vehicle, but one which a normal home handy type man restorer could own and store........about the size of a aussie army 6x6 landrover(which is similar vehicle for uses and payload )
The motor is only 2.2 litre petrol, and forget about any diesel repowering ideas without gearing up grades which may not be to straight forward to do.
First impressions in driving it after stepping out of my 101 landy is the lack of power.
Top speed with the motor screaming its ti@s off is 100 KPH and is happy at 75 KPH cruise speed.
The gearbox had a big jump from 6th to 5th, but the motor is flexable enough to handle it.
A few things stood out at me with this vehicle.
Its portal diffs and lockers with low gearing is fantastic.......those deep washed out rutted roads and tracks are no problem.
The ride for a coil sprung load carrying vehicle is not that good( a defender 130 and the twin leafs of the 101 landy do a better job.)
The way the cabin and rear tray and chassis is designed to flex is brillant.
Forget any long distance touring....the vehicle will do it, but just was not designed for it , even my 101 landy is more comfortable over distances.
Its lack of power wastes alot of its advantages off road with the portals and lockers ect and the drive one of these vehicle off road with a load is very.very slow and alot off work.
To change a clutch, is a cabin off job and work on oil seals on the portals etc is alot of work too. Rubbish
Would I have one.......the answers is yes.......they are well built and generally pactical for what they were designed for.
You must look at if you have the correct needs to own one and not just looking for that I own a Mog image.

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It never ceases to amaze me how ill informed some people are, both of the above statements are incorrect.

well then ......add the correction so we may all know

I would happy to be corrected.
I do know now with current army recovery vehicles the winch doesnt have to be removed to lift tow as the gear is now designed with these vehicles in mind.
S404 cabin off for the clutch......this information came from the owner as well as the the portal seal deal.( there is another way to do it but it is just as hard.)
Early aust army Mogs are converted from left hand drive and do have a duplex morse chain for steering under the dashboard and I think it is more than 9 belts fitted on the front of the motor too.
When I was in RAEME the blokes working on these things were winching the diffs apart to drop the torque tube drives from the transmission in the field.
I am not a knocker of the Mogs........each model appears to be different and they are different to work on in various ways.
A problem when they first came in to service for the Aust army was the VMs tool boxes didnt have much in the way of metric spanners and no large allen bolt key drive sockets.
Much has changed now .

There is a huge difference between a 1960's 404 and an SBU/U Series unimog - like comparing a Series 1 or 2 to a Defender. You care correct about the 404 needing the cab off and having a tiny petrol engine. You would have to be pretty hardcore to tour in a 404 - hot, noisy, basically like any 1960's designed truck. the 406/416 are halfway "civilised" a big step up from a 404, but nowhere near the comfort of a SBU/U series.

The SBU/ U series Unimogs are much easier to work on. If you don't have an overdrive, you can do the clutch in about an hour, as the transmission is separate from the engine. Portal axles require maintenance - change the oil regularly, as the only hold 600ml each. Transmissions can be dropped out from underneath, but Dave (Blknight) know a lot more about that than I do. Cab tilts for easy access to the engine for major overhauls, but most things can be done just opening the bonnet like a normal car.

The gearbox on a SBU is 8 speed, gear ratios are pretty good, but there is a relative large gap between 7th and 8th. That's where the overdrive/gear splitter comes into play, the 22% overdrive splits the gears nicely.

Top speed of a standard U series mog is around 90-95kph for military, and a lot less for the "working" mogs, maybe 75-80kph. That's where bigger tyres, overdrives and "fast axles" are required, however are some downsides in this

Most U series military mogs don't have the "working gears" - basically a low range set-up. Some military ones have them, most don't. You can't just add working gears to a transmission, it needs the correct main shaft for it to work. If you set-up your mog for a high top speed with bigger tyres and "fast axles", then first gear also gets quite high, making slow downhill descents very tricky, especially for mogs without an exhaust brake. I've seen some interesting video of an inexperienced owner on a steep hill using the brakes instead of gears as the first gear is just too high for a safe decent - like trying to go downhill in high range instead of low.

I've got the best of both worlds, fast axles, overdrive, big tyres etc for high speed of around 110kph @2400rpm and proper working gears, so my "low range - first gear" max speed at 2600rpm will be around 1.9kph, in high range that will be around 10kph.

A/C, sound and heat insulation is a must - just like on a Defender. I'll find out how my efforts work soon I hope.

Unimog mountain goat :)

mountain pass Argentina - YouTube

This is a U1300L - a meduim size Unimog on a very narrow mountain pass.
Whilst it is bigger than a 110, it has a better turning circle, some of the tight turns would be a big hairy in a 130, and this Mog goes around in one go, some pretty good driving in this big truck.