What is Australias Official language? Not what you think

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

Wrong. Many people who have been refused immigration to Australia, or can only come here on short term visas have been able to go to New Zealand and obtain citizenship there. They then come to Australia as a New Zealand citizen, no Visa required, and with right of residence. One improvement has been made in recent years. Kiwis can no longer access our welfare system until after two years. This stopped kiwis having long holidays here on the rock'n roll.

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An absolute load of bollocks that has been feed to the general Australian public and swallowed hook line and sinker. and is often used by the government to smoke screen another lest favorable immigration policy. that’s easy to spot yourself if you wish to do some investigation. Like the 2000 introduction of visas for kiwis and the quadrupling of Chinese immigration.

If a skilled immigrant only gains 115 points on the Australian system this may, MAY be enough to gain a work visa for nz. Now we are comparing an immigrant visa for Australia to a 2 year work visa for NZ.

Now if they get 120 points for Australia they arrive have to show that they have worked full time for 2 years then they get there permanent residency.

New Zealand they have to show they have worked for 2 years before they can apply for residency.

An Australian immigrant can apply for citizenship basically as soon as they have gotten there permanent residency

A New Zealand immigrant has to have permanent residence for 3 years before applying for NZ citizenship.

Australian citizenship involves a police check and exam and an oath of allegiance

NZ citizenship consists of a police check an internal affairs interview ( not all pass, IN English) where it is at the discretion of the interviewing officers and then an oath of allegiance.

So from the time of application to citizenship, Australia it seems to be about 3.5 years
New Zealand about 7 years.

so yes it is a little easier if you have the correct skills or education, but then the NZ skills list is much smaller than the aussie list, thus there are less possible applicants. The 2 systems are actually very different both in law and application with much of the NZ requirement being based on government officials opinions where Australia its just a tick all the boxes sort of thing.

To high light the differences lets have a look at family visas

an Australian citz goes over seas meets an potential spouse, returns to aussie, fills out the paperwork, medical, police check etc and about 6-9 month later the spouse arrives in aussie, you get married with in 6 months and then a bit down the track the spouse gets her citizenship ( after doing the test etc)

A new Zealand citz goes over seas, meets a potential spouse, retunes to NZ. That’s it there are NO visa options. Ok so you think the spouse can go to NZ on a tourist Visa. NO not if immigration catch you ( do you have a Girl/ boy friend in NZ, Yes, ok you can stay in jail to night and we will send you home in the morning)
THERE is no visa for NZ citizens to bring there partners to NZ. Marriage means nothing to NZ immigration.
you can sponsor your partner but you must demonstrate at least 2 years of living as a family ( which you cant do in NZ) but to sponsor you must have a job, house etc etc, how the hell can you do all that if you are living over seas ( with your partner)

On the other hand the Australian government will welcome any New Zealander and there non new Zealander spouse with a very simple and special visa ( subsection 461)

Welfare system, well partly true, Medicare basically from the day of arrival, family benefit, rent assistance etc etc from day one.
As for Australians going on holiday to NZ on the rock and roll as you put it. and or separated parents who wish to try and skip out on there child payments. either way the NZ government send the Australian government the bill for Dole payments and hunts down the defaulting parents and will hand on the bill for the Australian government etc. The NZ government started doing this because of the over whelming numbers of Australians hiding in NZ.

But back to your original topic.
http://www.immi.gov.au/media/statistics/statistical-info/temp-entrants/nz.htm
Is a list of NZ citizens living in Australia listed by there country of birth. You will see that 20-24 percent of NZ citizens were not born in NZ. BUT what is not clear is that many of the pacific islands (not all) have the right to NZ citizenship anyway. Nor will it show how many were immigrants to NZ as children ( with there parents) and are effectively Kiwi in thought and action.
But that is to be expected anyway as NZs population is made up of about 24% immigrants anyway

Australia is the same at about 25% so that leaves me thinking. What is your point or more to the point is that you haven’t made your point. That immigrants go to NZ to get citizenship only to come to Australia?

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Originally Posted by 85 county

An absolute load of bollocks that has been feed to the general Australian public and swallowed hook line and sinker. and is often used by the government to smoke screen another lest favorable immigration policy. that’s easy to spot yourself if you wish to do some investigation. Like the 2000 introduction of visas for kiwis and the quadrupling of Chinese immigration.

If a skilled immigrant only gains 115 points on the Australian system this may, MAY be enough to gain a work visa for nz. Now we are comparing an immigrant visa for Australia to a 2 year work visa for NZ.

Now if they get 120 points for Australia they arrive have to show that they have worked full time for 2 years then they get there permanent residency.

New Zealand they have to show they have worked for 2 years before they can apply for residency.

An Australian immigrant can apply for citizenship basically as soon as they have gotten there permanent residency

A New Zealand immigrant has to have permanent residence for 3 years before applying for NZ citizenship.

Australian citizenship involves a police check and exam and an oath of allegiance

NZ citizenship consists of a police check an internal affairs interview ( not all pass, IN English) where it is at the discretion of the interviewing officers and then an oath of allegiance.

So from the time of application to citizenship, Australia it seems to be about 3.5 years
New Zealand about 7 years.

so yes it is a little easier if you have the correct skills or education, but then the NZ skills list is much smaller than the aussie list, thus there are less possible applicants. The 2 systems are actually very different both in law and application with much of the NZ requirement being based on government officials opinions where Australia its just a tick all the boxes sort of thing.

To high light the differences lets have a look at family visas

an Australian citz goes over seas meets an potential spouse, returns to aussie, fills out the paperwork, medical, police check etc and about 6-9 month later the spouse arrives in aussie, you get married with in 6 months and then a bit down the track the spouse gets her citizenship ( after doing the test etc)

A new Zealand citz goes over seas, meets a potential spouse, retunes to NZ. That’s it there are NO visa options. Ok so you think the spouse can go to NZ on a tourist Visa. NO not if immigration catch you ( do you have a Girl/ boy friend in NZ, Yes, ok you can stay in jail to night and we will send you home in the morning)
THERE is no visa for NZ citizens to bring there partners to NZ. Marriage means nothing to NZ immigration.
you can sponsor your partner but you must demonstrate at least 2 years of living as a family ( which you cant do in NZ) but to sponsor you must have a job, house etc etc, how the hell can you do all that if you are living over seas ( with your partner)

On the other hand the Australian government will welcome any New Zealander and there non new Zealander spouse with a very simple and special visa ( subsection 461)

Welfare system, well partly true, Medicare basically from the day of arrival, family benefit, rent assistance etc etc from day one.
As for Australians going on holiday to NZ on the rock and roll as you put it. and or separated parents who wish to try and skip out on there child payments. either way the NZ government send the Australian government the bill for Dole payments and hunts down the defaulting parents and will hand on the bill for the Australian government etc. The NZ government started doing this because of the over whelming numbers of Australians hiding in NZ.

But back to your original topic.
http://www.immi.gov.au/media/statistics/statistical-info/temp-entrants/nz.htm
Is a list of NZ citizens living in Australia listed by there country of birth. You will see that 20-24 percent of NZ citizens were not born in NZ. BUT what is not clear is that many of the pacific islands (not all) have the right to NZ citizenship anyway. Nor will it show how many were immigrants to NZ as children ( with there parents) and are effectively Kiwi in thought and action.
But that is to be expected anyway as NZs population is made up of about 24% immigrants anyway

Australia is the same at about 25% so that leaves me thinking. What is your point or more to the point is that you haven’t made your point. That immigrants go to NZ to get citizenship only to come to Australia?

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I worked for Australia's Department of Social Security and I can assure you that many people who had been unable to immigrate to Australia were accepted by New Zealand and later turned up here with a New Zealand passport. Popular ploy with Africans in the 1990's. Australia was where they wanted to come in the first place but were considered unacceptable, if not undesirable. We also have large numbers of unskilled Polynesians here on NZ passports who have become a social problem. These people would have no chance of being accepted as immigrants. It appeared to us at DSS that NZ would accept virtually anybody as an immigrant, all the world's scumbags and undesirables. Commonly, Kiwis were regarded by many DSS staff as parasites.

Reciprocity of welfare payments applies to pensions, not unemployment payments, for the simple reason that NZ is unable to afford to repay Australia the unemployments paid to NZ citizens in Australia, there are too many of them, and the repayments would break New Zealand. Further, unemployment payment recipients are subject to degrees of control and review and the Australian government was not satisfied with the New Zealand system, that the recipients would not be supervised to the extent of the Australian system, perusal of fortnightly applications (a legal declaration of their activities), attendance at their Job Service Provider, regular reviews, field officer visits, and so on .

The NZ pensioner who come to Australia and applies for a pension here under reciprocity has to meet the Australian criteria for grant of pension. Quite a few NZ disability pensioners havce got a shock when they applied here and were told "Sorry, but you do meet the criteria for grant of disability pension, you are not disabled by our standards. After two years you may apply for unemployment payments if you are willing to seek and accept suitable work".

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

I worked for Australia's Department of Social Security ".

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But not Australian immigration

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

and I can assure you that many people who had been unable to immigrate to Australia were accepted by New Zealand and later turned up here with a New Zealand passport. Popular ploy with Africans in the 1990's. Australia was where they wanted to come in the first place but were considered unacceptable, ".

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If true that would only be on skills visa and the difference is about the equivalent of 5 points IE 4%. BUT how can you assure us of that. As you said you didn’t work for immigration so where do you get this information from? Some Polly flapping off on TV or do you know one or two south Africans who have Kiwi passports? Where are the number supporting your claims?

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

if not undesirable. ".

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NZ police and security checks exceed Australian requirements. You can check both web sites for this information. It is actually quite easy.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

We also have large numbers of unskilled Polynesians here on NZ passports who have become a social problem. These people would have no chance of being accepted as immigrants. It appeared to us at DSS that NZ would accept virtually anybody as an immigrant. ".

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Did you read my Post or not. Did I not say that many Polynesian islands have rights to NZ citizenship? I believe this was what Australia wanted and signed up with NZ. It has something to do with Germans and WW1.
Besides since Auckland is the biggest Polynesian city in the world and has been for some time now. Would logic not dictate that not all of these Polynesians are immigrants, may be they were born in NZ or god forbid maybe they are even 3 – 4 – 5th generation Kiwis?

Out off the 70 000 Polynesians in Australia 15000 came from NZ so I wouldn’t say that NZ is a Polynesian gate way to Australia.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

Reciprocity of welfare payments applies to pensions, not unemployment payments, ".

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Not only pensions. but correct not unemployment benefits.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

, for the simple reason that NZ is unable to afford to repay Australia the unemployments paid to NZ citizens in Australia, too many of them, and the repayments would break New Zealand. ".

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Now that’s just Bollocks. When the aussie pollys tried to run this one up the flagpole in 1999 they had to pull it down again. The end result and solution so they could save face is the administration fee paid by Australia to NZ to balance out the payments made by each country. Note that the money goes to NZ from Australia.

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Originally Posted by Brian Hjelm

The NZ pensioner who come to Australia and applies for a pension here under reciprocity has to meet the Australian criteria for grant of pension. Quite a few NZ disability pensioners have got a shock when they applied here and were told "Sorry, but you do meet the criteria for grant of disability pension, you are not disabled by our standards. After two years you may apply for unemployment payments if you are willing to seek and accept suitable work".

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That only proves that the requirements for a disability pension is lower in NZ than in Australia. So an aussies who do not meet the disability criteria in Australia may meet the NZ criteria, thus many Australians move to NZ which is good for them but bad for aussie because the aussie government pays the NZ government what ever the NZ government pays the aussie claimant which would be nothing if they remained in aussie. Even better NZ gets to keep the GST and Tax. Yeppa real smart move by Australian pollys that one.

Brian i am sorry but you seem to be stuck on the same old record. Unfortunately the numbers and facts just don’t support your claim.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/im...013/07/506.jpg

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Originally Posted by disco2hse

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/im...013/07/506.jpg

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x 2 ...chuckle chuckle

There is a good old saying that comes to mind Brian "if you don't like the way us kiwi's are running your country then you can always leave"

Anyway I'm off now gotta go and cash in my dole check.

cheers,
Terry

I've seen your garage Terry,,
so the cheque must be this big at least--
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/im...010/11/201.jpg

:Rolling:;)

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Originally Posted by TerryO

x 2 ...chuckle chuckle

There is a good old saying that comes to mind Brian "if you don't like the way us kiwi's are running your country then you can always leave"

Anyway I'm off now gotta go and cash in my dole check.

cheers,
Terry

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Yes I read there are lots more Ozzies coming to Nz than before and pensions get exchanged, we have a couple down the street and they love it cost of living cheaper, etc and no travelling to get things etc, just the weather is not so good and now if you check the figure Nz ers are NOT the most unemployed immigrant group per 1000 people etc in Ozzie. And the old joke when Malcolm Fraser complained about the amount of lower class uneducated Nzers going to Ozzie and claiming the dole the NZ Prime minister said it benefited both countries as it raised the average IQ of both countries, I do not think he ever recovered from that.

If you come from Tasmania then you would feel right at home in most of NZ, that is weatherwise and the number of sheep.;)

cheers,
Terry

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Originally Posted by TerryO

If you come from Tasmania then you would feel right at home in most of NZ, that is weatherwise and the number of sheep.;)

cheers,
Terry

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:confused:

I thought Tasmania WAS a part of New Zealand? :twisted:

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Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

:confused:

I thought Tasmania WAS a part of New Zealand? :twisted:

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The East Island perhaps.