Ban wire barriers !!!!!

Just from the little reading I've done this morning,,

There is very little research available about injuries to bikers anywhere in the world. In australia its non-existent.

The few that have been done in Europe rely more on common sense and injury analysis than actual physical barrier trials.

a few quick snipperts--
its better to hit a concrete block a glancing blow than a W post at all,,
The use of armco at ground level is preferable to a w post every 3 metres,,
In Europe they use flexible linings in front of the armco.
It is much preferable to spread the impact over as much body as possible,(hence the preferred concrete barriers)

On my recent trip through Victoria and SA my son and i did notice mostly on "black spot roads" an extension to the ground of the regular crash barrier on corners. This extension did seem to be of a fairly light construction but you still would not want to hit it at any speed.
It is probably an improvement on several taught 16mm wires.
Im glad these things look scary it frightens my son enough to keep him off a bike.
I think the Red and Black posts with crosses along the sides of the road in SA are a nice touch.

Someone should talk to Clover Moore, Lord mayor of Sydney about all of this. You should point out the reduced environmental impact that bikes do over other forms of 4 wheeled transport.

She'll probably start installing motorcycle ways and close even more roads to parking and driving of cars and trucks. :twisted:

I live at the bottom of the Gillies Highway in North Queensland.....200 something corners in 19km. Read, "kids in back with tummy ache" It has never had any barriers and accumulates quite a few fatalities, usually a few bikes a yr. Many more go off, but in some way survive....I know many stories from friends etc.

They are now upgrading and putting armco on all the drop off side corners. If they did the standard armco with posts with a gap under the railing it would definitely help with cars and help kill heaps of bikies. To counter this they are putting a second rail right round the bottom at ground level it is of lighter construction and flatter than the top armco rail but is still steel. Looks like if you hit it hard enough it would give between posts. I got out and had a bit more of a look. It is not an ideal solution but i genuinely think the whoever was responsible for this decision has made a real effort to think of the bike riders that ride this road. It seems the best solution ive seen of Aust roads so far....Of course there will be some who die hitting the barrier that would have survived the fall off the edge, just depends where and when and which trees you hit on the way down. At least its easier to find the bodies this way :wasntme:

Now all they have to do is stop the mill trucks using it and dropping mill mud on the corners. Read, "grease"

You're all better off than the rider in the tour de france who got punted into the barbed wire fence by a media car and got 30 stitches in his calf alone and finished the stage before getting it fixed.

Wire barriers are simply a way to reduce the impacts of car accidents which are the main form of accidents on the road. As a motorcyclist I believe that these "cheese cutters" are another example of the short sightedness of the government and road incident managers. As 4wd owners we should also be outraged at wire barriers as they have the potential to flip vehicles with high centres of gravity, rather than slowing them down. Think about that next time you see one!

In my mind they are a poor solution to the problem. Its similar to the problems of 'a' pillars in cars. Since new requirements for A pillar width (increase in size) have increased due to rollover requirements, which are relitively rare, incidents of pedestrians being hit by cars has gone up 300% due to reduced visibility of drivers. T bones and cyclist/motorcyclist accidents where cars are at fault have also increased. So by solving a relitively rare sitution of vehicle rollover, they have created a more serious situation. If anyone wants to argue this position take it up with mra and twowheels which gave me the data!

Ban wire rope barriers. They impinge on the safety of minority road user groups such as 4wds and motorcyclists!

Having recently done design work on a QLD highway, we prescribed large amounts of wire rope barrier. There are several reasons:

Cheaper to install (over large lengths)
Cheaper to repair
Easier to repair
You can't glance off it into other traffic
You can't drive through it to oncoming lanes or fall down drop offs
Also more aesthetically pleasing

There are limits to how tight a curve the barrier can go around while still being cost effective.

I reckon if you're gonna ride a bike (which I want to) it should be taken into account as a hazard, just like cars, road slipperyness, roadside objects, etc...

I have ridden motorcycles on and off-road for years.
I don't have an issue with the wire rope barrier concept, but I do with where I see them being used in many instances.

First rule: Unlike cars, motorcycles crash only in a roughly straight line, they do not spin out and go in another direction.
So: Do not put put wire rope barriers around the outside of bends where a bike and rider (if crashing) cannot fail to impact at 45-70degrees to the barrier (common sense tells me this slices the rider up a bit).

In Victoria the roads that have been funded specifically for motorcycle safety use the armco with a lower section that prevents a rider sliding underneath. But in many other places the lower cost has seen wire rope barriers installed in less than appropriate situations.

I have no issue with wire rope barriers being used to prevent large heavy vehicles (meaning cars and trucks) from crossing the centre of a divided road (freeway/highway) along the straight sections. These barriers are very effective for that purpose.

But they are not effective with trucks, vans and 4 wds!

I can understand your concerns and your right to question any new technology that may affect your life or the potential to lose your life.

I was personally involved in trials of wire rope barriers in NZ back in the early 90s and was responsible for writing the responses to questions put forward by the public and alternative scenario to actual instances and accidents involving actual wire rope barriers. These responses were based on the extensive trials that were previously carried out and were remodeled every time some Polly or Coroner requested it.
I still regard it as my best civilian tasking with a great sense of achievement knowing that I played a small part in saving many lives.

Although the design has changed some what from when I was involved the basics are still the same. For example the replacing of wooden posts with plastic. wood and plastic brakes as opposed to steel that bends and creates another Hassid.

Compared to Armco or cement barriers the wire rope was much more successful. I say that but there are some provisos.

Wire rope barriers are a separation instrument and not a barrier per say. That is a wire rope should not be used in front of any other obstacle. IE a cliff or any other vertical Hassid.

the wire rope unlike cement or Armco has quite a bit of give, in short it will absorb quite a lot of energy where cement is the worse as it absorbs very little in comparison, that’s why vehicles bounce off, or bounce in to other vehicles or off the other side of the road. or in extreme cases the cement explodes this in itself absorbs little energy and creates another Hassid with lumps of cement flying into oncoming traffic as well as the vehicle now crossing on to the other side of the road in to the oncoming traffic.

Motorcycles by comparison are top heavy and unlike other vehicles are made up of two parts, the bike and the rider. In most instances the rider travels further than the bike. 60% of property damage ( non vehicle) and 25% of secondary personal injury is caused by the rider impacting property or another person. A bike hitting a barrier at speed upright at an angle may result in the bike running along the rope and the rider pined by there leg and remaining with the bike or the rider separating from the bike and sort of flopping on to the other side. Nasty damage to the lower lims but the velocity of the rider entering the path of oncoming traffic is greatly diminished. And since this velocity is diminished there is less chance or further damage to the rider. compare this to either Armco or cement where lower lim damage is marginally less but the velocity of the rider entering the oncoming traffic is far greater with a matching increase in risk of the rider contacting oncoming traffic, which leads to further impacts and injury or death. Or further impact injury with the rider impacting the road. Either way there is no nice options but the rope is the lesser of the evils and far safer for other innocent motorists especially those in oncoming vehicles.

A dropped bike hitting a barrier. this is done either bike first then rider impacting the same point or rider then bike impact the same point and lastly rider and bike impacting different points.

1 the bike hits the ropes, some of its energy is absorbed by the wire. The bike will not be fired up wards or over the barrier. The rider hits the bike, this is no different to Armco or cement. It is after all a rider bike impact. There is the reduced chance of the bike coming down on the rider.
2 well there is little difference here but there is the chance of the rider bouncing though the ropes or being partially though the rope before the bike impacts. either way much better than being the meet in an Armco/cement/ bike

separate impacts. Well the bike as in "1". The rider as in 2 .

it is hard to design a barrier system that will handle 40+ tone trucks and motorcycles. From what I know of the topic the wire rope system was a stroke of brilliance. Though I can understand the initial reservations and comments like the "cheese cutter". fortunately this is not the case.

NB wire rope barriers are not cheaper than Armco