Thread: Snatch strap misuse danger

Originally Posted by Disco Muppet

I'm fine for snatching from the back off the tow point, but seeing as so many D2 front recovery point manufacturers have disappeared, looks like ill have to get a winch.
If anyone knows people who still make D2 front recovery points, let us know!
Cheers
Muppet

Wouldn't be hard with an angle grinder and a drill press, just build them out of heavy enouhg steel and have them mounted sufficiently, a 'rated' recovery point is built to a certain load capability, they are mostly just mild steel, so if you get flat bar in the right size it would not be a hard job to make them, personally i don't like snatching of the chassis rails of a vehicle though, that why we pull with the towbar which is in the middle and loads the chassis evenly

Originally Posted by MR LR jnr.

personally i don't like snatching of the chassis rails of a vehicle though, that why we pull with the towbar which is in the middle and loads the chassis evenly

wouldn't an equalizer strap be the go between two front points then?

Frank, some reading for your afternoon nap

Regulation impact statement motor vehicle recovery straps
Product Safety Hazard Response Branch.
Australian Competition and Consumer Commission

Snatch Straps | Motoring | RACQ

4WD Recovery Kit | NRMA Motoring & Services

That depends who you ask haha, ive seen photos of chassis that have had the rails bent in closer together and the front crossmember bent, really i think the best thing would be to have essentially another towbar built into the front of the chassis, like a discreet winch mount sorta thing, but pulling off the normal recovery points would be okay unless the vehicle was really heavy or really stuck, everyone has got an opinion on recovery and as you can see most of them don't match up, but everyone is an expert so they will never agree haha, i only speak of what i've experienced and been shown, there are a lot of idiots on youtube and rarely successful things get posted because they 'aren't funny' in reality this is only a very small sample of all the recoveries that happen.

Common sense isn't!
The reason we have W(O)H&S legislation is two -fold:
Greedy employers taking shortcuts to save money/ be more competitive in the market
Workers/ employers not thinking things through.

The legislation, and process of a formal hazard and risk assessment that leads in to safe practices provides a safetynet for those with minimal knowledge and training to perform a duty without risk of serious injuty or death. It also creates a repeatable tool for newcomers to Risk assessment to be effective in a short timeframe, rather than gather knowledge over a number of years.
Some argue that this is wrapping people up in cotton wool or creating a vicious circle of people who don't think about what they are doing. I have more pressing things to do than conduct a long term, double blind study to deduce the 'Truth'.


What I do know is, keeping people away from large amounts of Potential energy Saves lives.

Knowing your limitations Saves Lives.

Using equipment suitable for the task in a way that the manufacturers designed and spent large amounts of money testing/ redesigning and adding large amounts of redundency into, Saves lives.

Doing a bit of preparation to minimise the amount of force required Saves Lives.

Google :4wd recovery course and look at the options. New technology in equipment and materials (PRT and Dyneema rope, where were they 15 years ago?) and results of inquests that change how we do things mean that unless you are an active member of a club that uses all types of recovery equipment on a regular basis WITH the technical understanding of the properties and physics involved, you could do with a refresher!
~$200 can save you $000s in damage/ recovery costs or someones life. It can also save you heaps on misspent cash on the wrong gear.
Hope this helps.
Dave.

Originally Posted by Disco Muppet

I
If anyone knows people who still make D2 front recovery points, let us know!
Cheers
Muppet

Google MR Automotive , Redcliffe, Qld. Bob

It looks like I'm not alone by feeling apprehensive when watching the use of snatch straps.

My first Land Rover that I owned, never ever saw a snatch strap, but it had a front mounted drum winch that I made from the 4.8 :1 diff of a ford prefect and powered from the centre p.t.o. via a 2:1 chain drive reduction running in a a oil filled case, that winch did break the 5/8" wire rope on a couple of occasions, once when a pulley should have been used, it broke when pulling a twit out of a button grass plain swamp, he didn't take any notice of the trip leader and tore off into the depths of the bottomless button grass, when he stopped the nose of the 2A shorty was in that far that the windscreen was level with the top of the ground, to reach him the wire rope was at the end of the wrap on the drum and was passed through the p.t.o. hole at the back of the chassis and hooked back on itself, that is where it broke.
To get enough anchorage, I had ran my S1 shorty into the bog and buried it as best I could, then used the rope to rock the other Land Rover around. It made a hell of a mess pulling the button grass up in a huge mound against the side, until the back of the other one came around enough to side past.

Before you all write letters to editor complaining about damage to the environment, the button grass at that place is floating on a soup of water and
rotted material ( yes it stinks ) and it simply flows back into any holes.

I have seen a truck with it's chassis twisted diagonally beyond repair when pulled from one rail only by a bull dozer and chain.
A couple of times I have had bogged tractors left for weeks until the ground dries out enough to get a pull back onto it.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment...1&d=1338719314
Another hangup. Rubber's Case IH MX100C In Trouble Again
Yesterday's Tractors - Tractor Pictures - - - Tractors in Trouble
.

I've followed this thread with some intrest and I feel that I have to comment. I can see both sides of the argument as for the pros and cons of the snatch strap. I have been lucky enough to have done several driver courses and a guns course both here and in the UK and all the courses have involved a recovery and off road component. Each of the recovery phases have been taught by extremely professional recovery mechanics (recce mechs) who do this stuff for a living and we are tested and only signed off as competent when we are able to show safe working practices. We are not taught the use of snatch straps because of the inherent danger through it's misuse. Our vehicles are supplied with bow shackles,chains, winches and the good old shovel. I have never needed a snatch strap in a military situation and believe me digging a mog and gun out of a quagmire at 2am is no fun (actually, it really is...sometimes). All of the equipment is tested 12 monthly and retagged. However, I do have and have used often a snatch strap in my private off road life. But I put it to you, how many of you sit back and have a cup of tea and then work out the pull required to do the job. Let's say a 2 tonne rover, on a 20 deg slope in thick mud? Who out there knows or cares what the breaking strain is of their 8mm steel wire rope? Who really knows if there repco winch is really rated at 12,000ib? The stuff my mates and I have seen "civvies" do makes us cringe and walk away. Even some stuff from the experienced club members is just plan dangerous. So I'm sorry to say that when I read comments like "I've done stuff on the farm and won't do it again, it's a learning curve" well, son you need to grow up, do a nationally recognised course and "get some time up" Mate you ain't learnt anything and you are going to kill someone someday. It's just a matter of time.

Nino