Snatch strap misuse danger

Keep the info coming,
I know theres a lot of misinformation, (guilty) misunderstanding out there, and also lots of knowledge, common sense & 'good old know how' .

But good old know how and common sense just isn't enough,

When I first heard about a Snatch Strap I thought the guys were talking about an item of underwear from the ladies deptertment. It wasn't until I was on a club trip in the early 1980's and a Series 2 got stuck, a bloke in a Rangie backed up to him and hooked up a strap and to my horror took off at flat chat in low 3rd, I thought he was nuts & that the bumper would come off for sure, Then I first saw how this strap worked like giant elastic band and gracefully & gently unstuck the Series 2, then I realised what this Snatch Strap was that they were talking about.

Common Sense would have dictated you should never do that, and I never would have unless I saw that with my own eyes.

You can't always sum up a situation by just looking at it. Im also still learning stuff right here and now, If I'd come across a stuck D2 in the bush, sure I'd have had a go at recovering it. If the guy had screwed a pintle to the front of the Bumper I'd have had a good look & made sure it was bolted good & solid then said Fair enough theres a good recovery point & got my strap out.

Not anymore, I will never snatch out another 4x4 after what Ive read here & seen on youtube clips, I'll be keeping my Tirfor in the car now instead of collecting dust in the shed.

Also noted Dianas comment about what would happen to Snatch Straps under WorkCover rules, its true. In Telstra we had to replace our pole belts every 3 years weather they ever got used or not & the old ones WERE physically destroyed, even if they were still as new unused.

And another note on a smaller kinetic energy strap, The Ocky Strap, if we were caught with an Ocky Strap in the van it was instant dismissal, no ifs buts or why's, , same physics applies to snatch straps., but 100x more dangerous.

check this out

http://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/worksa...tor_killed.pdf

I suggest Recovery straps will be banned in the near enough future, but unfortunately will probably take one or two more deaths & a couple of coronial inquiries before that happens.

Motor vehicle recovery straps

Another thing about Risk Assesments and Vehicle Recovery,
In Telecom if we got bogged, we were not allowed to call up a mate, colleague or whoever to get pulled out, We had to advise the Team Leader then call RACV or National Towing & wait it out. They are the ones that have do the Risk Assesment, And they never ever use a snatch strap, & yes I got very stuck at times, because those cables are not always laid in firm ground.

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Originally Posted by landy

I have seen 1. Fraser island. Guy with a brand new jeep wrangler bogged to the axles. Pulls out a "snatch strap" 1" to 1.5" wide, unopened and unrated in a no name packet, for a 1.8 tonne car. No idea how to use it. 2. Toolangi, guy with an 80 series. Snatch strap snapped so he knotted to halfs together 2 YEARS BEFORE!! And 3. Murrandinji, another 80 series. Guy winching his truck with a hand operated ratchet puller something thingy. Now with the exception of the wrangler, when I offered to help, using my recovery gear as what I saw was clearly unsafe I was told to eff off and mind my own business.. I think you can fall into 3 roughly broad groups. Those who have the good gear and bother to find out how to use it as having fun and getting home safe to talk over a beer about it is worth the effort. Those that can afford the good gear and just wait till they need it and hope someone will show them on the day and lastly the ones that don't give a rats backside and have crap. In my experience, and it's a general statement, look at the car. If its clearly unroadworthy ( and believe me there are lots of them) it means they dont give a toss if its unsafe on the road and will fall into to last group.

Nino

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Landy.For what it is worth don't use your equipment, the reason being if it fails you are liable for any consequences that may occur if your gear fails.I was warned by an insurance agent of this,I know its hard to believe but thats the world we live in.Cheers Lochie

Have i mis-read it or have you had a complete change of opinion since your previous post (not sarcasm is it, a lot of what you said is very true)? After reading this thread and the attachments i can say i have given a second thought to snatch straps and the conditions we use them in, maybe i'll use the drag chain on a straight pull more often instead of the snatch strap, can't say i'll give it away though 4 tractors are pretty hard for one bloke to drive at once haha. BUT i will use the advice the other posters have given to improve my technique, and i will seek to do a safety course after the HSC and before harvest this year, hopefully when i join a 4WD club or the RFS. What can i say you've changed my opinions a bit, not an easy feat ask mum haha, but one thing that noone i've worked with has ever done is use a dampner pack on the strap, that and the newspaper thing is the only things i can work out we've been doing wrong and now that i consider it i can see its a major issue, i'll make a big one out of a sheet of conveyor belt for the 40 tonner, i think the ARB one is a bit small haha. Sorry if i've offended anyone in previous posts, but i'm sure we'll all admit to being strong wiled, and not wanting to be proved wrong, but i can tell you i will do a lot more to minimise the risk in the future, with everything i do, not just snatching, maybe i'll rebuild the old Warn, might get used a bit more often when that bloody Land Cruiser sits down on its leaf springs in the mud.

Regards
Will

I am possibly unwittingly wandering into a minefield here but why not...gets me out of tomorrows exam! :twisted:
I happened to come across a video of what seemed to be a snatch recovery that was as safe as possible (given what i have picked up on, yet again i may be completely wrong).
strange thing was it was done by 4WD action!
now, given that i've never used a snatch strap, only drag chains and a hand winch i may be completely wrong and about to set off one of the aforementioned mines, could someone let me know?
Is this a good way to do it?
Obviously the vehicle isn't very stuck, straight line pull etc, but it seems to be okay in theory.
only thing i noticed was the lack of dampening bag. that and that he left his handbrake on :D
So forgive me if this is just an ignorant rambling, but i'd like to know your thoughts on their efforts.
( also forgive me for finding an example by 4WD action with shocking acting! :D)
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkHng7n6BBU]4WD Action - 116 Terrain Tamer Snatch Strap - YouTube[/ame]
Cheers
Muppet

I think that video is just about right - nice and gentle, no towballs used, (though they could have pointed that out), and some good advice about how the straps work and how to take care of them. Though I think they should have changed the music - for a moment there I thought I was going to watch something else!

Will, your last post was very good to see.

First up he should have pointed out that snatch straps can be dangerous, not "the safest thing in your recovery kit". You must remember this is the same bloke that described the main anchor pin in a Tirfor as the "Shear Pin", if this was the shear pin and it sheared the whole Tirfor would be off down the hill. The shear pins are at the base of the winching lever so that if you exceed limits they shear and stop you from winching. Everything else was OK, but it would have been just as easy to use a standard tow/extension strap, strap attachments were OK. It was a bit of a beat up, I think, I could see no reason to use a snatch strap in that scenario.
They could have, should have demonstrated the correct/safe way of snatching out a bogged vehicle, like using a shovel to reduce the drag on all 4 wheels, having a short keeper sling through the eye and shackle and attached to a seperate tow point to limit travel if the main tow point failed, a tree anchor sling would do. Driving off slow and trying to make it easier to move the vehicle if the first attempt at snatching fails.
They took the easy short way, when they could have done it properly, which would have been of far more use than that demo.
I have spoken to the editor of 4WD Action a few times about their total lack of understanding the basics of recoverys, they always come back with "but our expert says we are right", their expert turns out to be some bloke that works behind the counter of one of the 4WD shops that regularly advertise in the mag.
Looking at their issue #179 "Winch Tricks" proves the point they or their expert has no idea and some of their advice is dangerous. they are showing the use of multiple snatch blocks with wires going in all directions and different angles. Most people outside of the rigging industry would have no idea of the forces/tensions involved when you have extreme angles between ropes in a snatch block recovery, nothing wrong with that, there is no reason why the average punter would know the dynamics. But when you get the biggest 4WD mag in Australia spruiking dangerous stuff to the general population as Gospel, then it's time they were stopped. For instance they are showing a Jeep with it's winch cable going through a snatch block and to the vehicle being towed, the angle of the rope looks to be around 90 degrees or more. Well at that angle if the towed vehicle weighs 2 tonne then the tension/load on the cable doubles to 4 tonne and also on the anchor strap attached to the tree. Why, because the rope is trying it's best to make itself back into a straight line, so not only is it trying to pull 2 tonne dead it's also trying to straighten itself, so now your snatch block and achor rope and the tree is holding 4 tonne.
Also when you run a cable/rope through a snatch block in one direction and then run it in the opposite direction through another block you are destroying the cable/rope. Why, because when a cable runs over the groove in the snatch block the outside wires/fibres are stetched, while the inside wires/fibres (closest to the bottom of the groove) are crushed, then it goes through the same process in reverse, this action can cause the cable/rope to break, at the very least it causes irrepairable damage. As I said the gen. pop. knows none of this, but if you are going to be doing any recoveries you owe it to yourself to at least understand the forces at work during recoveries, snatch or not, Regards Frank.

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Originally Posted by Tank

First up he should have pointed out that snatch straps can be dangerous, not "the safest thing in your recovery kit". .

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pretty sure he said "can be lethal if used incorrectly".
His words were "most versatile piece of your recovery kit"
not a defence of him or his actions.
Obviously it is just a simple, 'light' explanation and example of snatching, but my point was they're not tearing off like hoons or snatching off the tow ball.
Could you explain what a keeper sling is?
Forgive me for dragging this out but as i said, zero practical knowledge.
Cheers for all the info, it's been a steep but useful learning curve!
Cheers
Muppet

Somethings up, posted 3 times, creepy, regards frank.

See above, regards Frank.

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Originally Posted by Disco Muppet

pretty sure he said "can be lethal if used incorrectly".
His words were "most versatile piece of your recovery kit"
not a defence of him or his actions.
Obviously it is just a simple, 'light' explanation and example of snatching, but my point was they're not tearing off like hoons or snatching off the tow ball.
Could you explain what a keeper sling is?
Forgive me for dragging this out but as i said, zero practical knowledge.
Cheers for all the info, it's been a steep but useful learning curve!
Cheers
Muppet

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I would use the tree protector sling (anchor sling) about 2 metres long with a WLL of 3 tonne. As I would not use my snatch strap to snatch someone else out of a bog I would only use theirs, so I would attach my tree protector sling through the eye of the snatch strap, shackle and tow point of the towed vehicle and attach the other end to another tow point or solid bit of chassis or whatever. That way if the tow point tears off my keeper sling will restrict or stop the shackle sling eye and tow point screaming through my back window, I know my end will not break, haven't actually tried it but I've seen it done and it is a good bit of insurance, Regards Frank.
P.S. You're right, i must be going deaf as well as demented, I apologise for misquoting Shaun.