Thread: Landcruiser & Caravan Rollover - Badly loaded ??

Originally Posted by johntins

60t trucks are designed for it. They have no other purpose. Their drivers are tested and licenced for it. Far cry from some fella who drives to the station everyday, and then at Easter loads up his car and van with absolutely no idea of what's needed, and then hitting the highway at 120 km/h, simply because he can afford it.

Cars are designed for it as well........pretty sure I have seen some average truck driving.

I don't think affordability has anything to do with it.

Not many places you can do 120km/hr legally.

I do a lot of miles for work and pass many caravans......the majority seem to get along just fine (excluding weights as it's impossible to tell when overtaking them), I don't think there is much wrong with the system apart from education.

The driver seemed to go right and then swing back left.
I wonder if trailer anti-sway control would have helped.

Originally Posted by weeds

Pretty sure I started a thread on the education that was organized by a policeman and industry experts.

I weigh my combination ls regularly...helps when you have a weigh bridge at work....touring in the hi-lux Struggled staying under rear axle weight and GVM for the lux, trailer was always within limits.

Trouble is, the axle groupings common to trailers and vans are close together. Harder to tell when a load is uneven. Overall weight, plus downward ( hopefully ) mass on the tow ball are the best you can do.

The greatest factor in all this, as I see it, is the totally compromised hitch setup created by fitting a tow bar at the very rear of the tow vehicle, and the very front of the vehicle being towed, coupled with the ignorance of some of the drivers ( I don't blame them, I blame the system). I know, we can't all have Dodge Rams with a fifth wheel setup, but that just makes it more important to set the thing up properly.

Just so that nobody thinks that I believe I'm perfect; I once put a car on a car trailer, and was towing it to a wrecker. It had no engine or gearbox, and was thus reasonably balanced. It also had no dampers in it. On the way, it developed a sway just like that in this vid, compounded by the bounce set up by the undamped springs. My stupidity put both cars, the trailer, my wife and me over an embankment. I was about 30 at the time. It was then that I learned that I didn't, in fact, know everything.

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

The driver seemed to go right and then swing back left.
I wonder if trailer anti-sway control would have helped.

Maybe, maybe not. There is now far too much reliance on tech, IMO.

Originally Posted by weeds

Cars are designed for it as well........

No, they are not. Cars are compromised because they have to do EVERYTHING. Ever heard the expression, "Jack of all trades, master of none"? Whacking 3 or more tonne of van or boat on the back of a 2 tonne car via a tow ball, with nobody having a clue how to load or the consequences of that ignorance is a recipe for disaster.

Originally Posted by weeds

pretty sure I have seen some average truck driving.

Strawman. Weak argument. Of course you have, but it is utterly irrelevant. Truck drivers are very heavily policed, for how they drive, and how they load.

Originally Posted by weeds

I don't think affordability has anything to do with it.

Really? Check out the rig that rolled in that vid. I know for sure that I couldn't afford it. However, I'll concede you that one rather than dwell on it.

Originally Posted by weeds

Not many places you can do 120km/hr legally.

I guessed you missed the comments re being overtaken when sitting on the speed limit that have been posted. Legality is irrelevant as well.

Originally Posted by weeds

I I don't think there is much wrong with the system apart from education.

Which is precisely my point. Nobody educates a car driver about towing. You have a Licence. You are free to hook a bloody great boat or van up to your car and off you go. Glad we agree on that.

Originally Posted by johntins

No, they are not. Cars are compromised because they have to do EVERYTHING. Ever heard the expression, "Jack of all trades, master of none"? Whacking 3 or more tonne of van or boat on the back of a 2 tonne car via a tow ball, with nobody having a clue how to load or the consequences of that ignorance is a recipe for disaster.




Strawman. Weak argument. Of course you have, but it is utterly irrelevant. Truck drivers are very heavily policed, for how they drive, and how they load.



Really? Check out the rig that rolled in that vid. I know for sure that I couldn't afford it. However, I'll concede you that one rather than dwell on it.



I guessed you missed the comments re being overtaken when sitting on the speed limit that have been posted. Legality is irrelevant as well.



Which is precisely my point. Nobody educates a car driver about towing. You have a Licence. You are free to hook a bloody great boat or van up to your car and off you go. Glad we agree on that.

Should I tell work i can no longer tow our trailers.....although it's only 2T with override brakes and I sit on the speed limit even the 110 zones. The next one will be bigger and heavier.

A truck (prime mover) is designed to travel safely with 22.5 tonne at the rear and 6 tonne on the steer. Those weights don't change even if the gvm is 45 tonne or 120 tonne. The design is compromised when the truck is driven without a trailer(s), but still within the design limitations, driven with extra care. A truck driver is trained and qualified in increments.
A car, conversely, is compromised with a trailer attached. A car driver is handed a licence after performing a reverse park and hill start in a Toyota Echo, then legally allowed to hitch a four tonne van to a three tonne 4x4 and head off into the wild blue yonder.
I'm not anti 'van, like cyclists, 99% of them do the right thing to the best of their ability.

Originally Posted by weeds

Should I tell work i can no longer tow our trailers.....although it's only 2T with override brakes and I sit on the speed limit even the 110 zones. The next one will be bigger and heavier.

Probably a bit late, you're no doubt competent now. The point being made is that a newly licenced driver is legally entitled to tow a heavy outfit without further training.