Thread: taking pets on spirit of tasmania

Originally Posted by AndyG

Dogs that chase sheep normally come ot a sudden end

True.
But considering she was on the farm we bought her from, she was out running with her mum and the other farm dogs and the farmer wasn't concerned in the slightest, I reckon she was reasonably safe from seeing the pointy end of his shotgun.

Wouldn't let her near anyone elses sheep though!

Originally Posted by Tassie

My guess would be that these animals would have died even if they weren’t on the boat, reason being is that thousands of animals travel across each year without any side effects...

So nothing could have possibly gone wrong on the basis that nothing has gone wrong before? I'm afraid I find it rather hard to subscribe to that theory...firstly because it's becoming apparent that a lot of animals die on the ferry every year and secondly that these are seriously fit and healthy animals we're talking about, in peak condition. Two trucks full of horses, only one truck had a problem...and instead of thinking it could be a localised issue such as a particularly hot area on board or an engine left running or a gas leak of some sort, your conclusion is that all of the horses on that particular truck were going to die anyway?

To each their own I suppose. in the polo community, we're all keen to find out. Carbon monoxide, suffocation, heat exhaustion; whatever it is, we need answers so people can improve standards.

Originally Posted by The Cone of Silence

So nothing could have possibly gone wrong on the basis that nothing has gone wrong before? I'm afraid I find it rather hard to subscribe to that theory...firstly because it's becoming apparent that a lot of animals die on the ferry every year and secondly that these are seriously fit and healthy animals we're talking about, in peak condition. Two trucks full of horses, only one truck had a problem...and instead of thinking it could be a localised issue such as a particularly hot area on board or an engine left running or a gas leak of some sort, your conclusion is that all of the horses on that particular truck were going to die anyway?

To each their own I suppose. in the polo community, we're all keen to find out. Carbon monoxide, suffocation, heat exhaustion; whatever it is, we need answers so people can improve standards.

“because it's becoming apparent that a lot of animals die on the ferry every year”

anymore info on this ? I’d be more than happy to release it to the media...
sounds like crap up story to me, without any actual facts to back it up yea, how about you...


Also seeing that you are part of the polo club so how about releasing the autopsies results ? Then the matter would certainly be resolved
Cheers

Originally Posted by Tassie

“because it's becoming apparent that a lot of animals die on the ferry every year”

anymore info on this ? I’d be more than happy to release it to the media...
sounds like crap up story to me, without any actual facts to back it up yea, how about you...


Also seeing that you are part of the polo club so how about releasing the autopsies results ? Then the matter would certainly be resolved
Cheers

To address your comments:

1. Use Google - there are several articles regarding dogs dying from carbon monoxide poisoning. Actual facts would appear to be the bodies of dead dogs. You have no need to release it to the media as it was widely reported already, so if this qualifies as a 'crap up story', then perhaps you can discuss the sources with the relevant publishers. By your earlier logic I'm sure these dogs would have died anyway.

In terms of additional and more anecdotal evidence (and let's face it, this is a forum, much of what we discuss is anecdotal and merely form our opinions on matters, which we share herein) I have spoken with a number of people in the equine livestock transportation business with friends doing the same who have suggested that if an animal e.g. a cow, sheep, horse etc does succumb on the journey...then it tends not to make the media as it gets settled rather quickly. This is not first hand evidence as I am not in the animal transportation business; I'm merely reporting the opinions of others as reported to me, but I believe them not to be liars.

2. 'seeing that you are part of the polo club so how about releasing the autopsies results'? I'd be glad to, but a polo club does not perform autopsies, it organises polo matches. The autopsies were performed by Wagga Wagga Equine Hospital, at the Faculty of Science at the Charles Sturt University, NSW. I refer you to the following from the ABC

"The hospital, which conducted autopsies on the ponies, has refused to release any information, including what happened to the two ponies which were found to have initially survived the Bass Strait crossing.

"Pathology reports were released to Tasmania's Department of Primary Industries, Parks, Water and Environment (DPIPWE) months ago, but the department will not say when, or even if, it will ever release the findings."

I agree with you wholeheartedly that the matter would surely be resolved should the DPIPWE release the findings, but they are not doing so. I wonder why that is!!! It's got out-of-court settlement written all over it, to avoid the SoT having to go into receivership simply to undergo an investigation and make any necessary changes....and the Government consequently having to come up with a way of getting people to and from the Apple Isle by sea.

This is merely my opinion, Tassie, and you are of course entitled to challenge mine and proffer your own, which I respect but as mentioned previously, do not subscribe to. My instincts here tell me something has gone wrong, not simply that these animals would have died anyway.

Originally Posted by The Cone of Silence

To address your comments:

1. Use Google - there are several articles regarding dogs dying from carbon monoxide poisoning. Actual facts would appear to be the bodies of dead dogs. You have no need to release it to the media as it was widely reported already, so if this qualifies as a 'crap up story', then perhaps you can discuss the sources with the relevant publishers. By your earlier logic I'm sure these dogs would have died anyway.

In terms of additional and more anecdotal evidence (and let's face it, this is a forum, much of what we discuss is anecdotal and merely form our opinions on matters, which we share herein) I have spoken with a number of people in the equine livestock transportation business with friends doing the same who have suggested that if an animal e.g. a cow, sheep, horse etc does succumb on the journey...then it tends not to make the media as it gets settled rather quickly. This is not first hand evidence as I am not in the animal transportation business; I'm merely reporting the opinions of others as reported to me, but I believe them not to be liars.

2. 'seeing that you are part of the polo club so how about releasing the autopsies results'? I'd be glad to, but a polo club does not perform autopsies, it organises polo matches. The autopsies were performed by Wagga Wagga Equine Hospital, at the Faculty of Science at the Charles Sturt University, NSW. I refer you to the following from the ABC

"The hospital, which conducted autopsies on the ponies, has refused to release any information, including what happened to the two ponies which were found to have initially survived the Bass Strait crossing.

"Pathology reports were released to Tasmania's Department of Primary Industries, Parks, Water and Environment (DPIPWE) months ago, but the department will not say when, or even if, it will ever release the findings."

I agree with you wholeheartedly that the matter would surely be resolved should the DPIPWE release the findings, but they are not doing so. I wonder why that is!!! It's got out-of-court settlement written all over it, to avoid the SoT having to go into receivership simply to undergo an investigation and make any necessary changes....and the Government consequently having to come up with a way of getting people to and from the Apple Isle by sea.

This is merely my opinion, Tassie, and you are of course entitled to challenge mine and proffer your own, which I respect but as mentioned previously, do not subscribe to. My instincts here tell me something has gone wrong, not simply that these animals would have died anyway.

Not it trying to create an internet argument here..
but you haven’t done your own autopsy’s ?
I doubt everything you say now.....
if it was me I certainly would have had my own done... basic oxygen saturation test would answer...

Originally Posted by Tassie

Not it trying to create an internet argument here..
but you haven’t done your own autopsy’s ?
I doubt everything you say now.....
if it was me I certainly would have had my own done... basic oxygen saturation test would answer...

The horses are not mine so why would I conduct autopsies?
The polo manager (not the owner) who was transporting them and found their bodies, organised the autopsies. That's all very obvious from reading the ABC article. The results however, have not been released to the PUBLIC. I suspect that if the results have been provided to the owner, that potentially what may have occurred is that a non-disclosure agreement or injunction has been issued, preventing him from releasing findings to the public on the basis of the commercial impact it might have on the Spirit of Tasmania before a sufficient investigation has reached conclusion....this of course is on the basis that an autopsy alone is not the only source of evidence in determining the cause of the animals' demise. I would have thought for example, that inspections of the vehicles, the ferry itself, analysis of footage of other vehicles in the cargo area, analysis of temperature levels, water access, water quality, air access, sea state, interviews with staff and involved parties across three jurisdictions etc would all need to be performed in order to draw a conclusion.

It's only speculation of course but it makes sense to me. I think it's being hushed up in case people think the ferry is too risky and stop using it, which has a larger commercial and economic impact than that of a billionaire having to buy or breed 16 new horses and get them trained. Perhaps I'm being cynical but it seems to make sense to me. Our community would like to know asap though so we can make improvements. Given that the SoT followed livestock carriage regulations, maybe those regulations need a review.

I'm afraid that I harbour little concern that you now doubt what I say. This is a FORUM, it's a place to share opinions and respectfully discuss our various differences of opinion in order to enjoy the dialogue. As an example, I find your logic that you think all of the horses were 'going to die anyway' because animals have survived the crossing before, flawed on several levels but I respect that it's your opinion and welcome it as part of the discussion.

Spirit of Tasmania owners sued over the deaths of 16 polo ponies amid claim they died on board - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)