Power prices, gas prices- ouch or Solar perhaps?

Yes, I expect my current set to last a lot longer than my last, mainly because at the tie of my lightning damage I greatly increased the wattage of solar panels - they are a lot cheaper now than they were in 1993. This means that they still produce useful amounts of power when the sunlight is not too good (like today).

But I am still a careful power user, and generally do not use power for heating or airconditioning. But it is used for most cooking. The house is well insulated, with underfloor heating which is run by the wood burning kitchen stove, which also heats the hot water when the hot water system's collector is inadequate in low sunlight conditions.

Power went out for five hours after the blow some of us had Saturday. 120kph winds [thumbsupbig][thumbsupbig][thumbsupbig]

New place and my shed is now up so Solar and hybrid inverter has been considered for last several months. It was about to happen. It was quoted with a 20kWh battery for less than 6k!

Me being a PITA tossed the city type as the system is going on and behind the new Shed/garage. That required a Sub Board. Wiring discussion for the supplier was hmmmmm. Called a good mate from Everest Energy who dropped a bombshell on me.

The Battery Rebates for Plebs is

[COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.8)]Here are some key points about battery rebates in Australia:[/COLOR]

• The Cheaper Home Batteries Program will start on July 1, 2025, providing an upfront discount of around 30% on the purchase and installation of home batteries.
  
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• Households could save approximately $4,000 off the upfront cost of installing an 11.5 kWh battery, which previously cost around $13,000.
  
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• The program is an expansion of the Small-scale Renewable Energy Scheme (SRES), which has been popular for solar panel rebates.
  
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• Eligibility for the rebate includes ensuring that the battery systems are compatible with virtual power plants (VPPs).
  
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• Additional rebates or incentives may be available from state and territory governments, depending on local criteria.
  
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  For more detailed information, you can refer to the official government resources or trusted energy websites.

What that misses is the KEY detail of the size limit of 50kWh battery and the ONCE off rebate! If I use the rebate for a 5-10kWh battery I cannot top it up to 50kWh in the future using the rebates!

The rebates may make a 50kWh cost a very small amount! Adding later would cost me $$$$$$$$$$ more.

I am back at the drawing board given this information dopey me had not noticed


Which Batteries Are Eligible For The Rebate?

Batteries need to meet some requirements:

• Batteries must be listed on the Clean Energy Council-approved product list (the same goes for new inverters. If you're using an existing inverter it does not have to be on the approved list, but you do have to ensure it is not included in the product recall list);
• A solar battery system with a nominal (total) capacity of 5 kWh to 100 kWh will be eligible, but only the first 50 kWh of usable capacity is discounted;
• Existing batteries can be expanded, provided that the battery system has not already received the rebate, the additional capacity is at least 5 kWh, and the upgraded battery does not exceed 100 kWh in nominal capacity;
• Only one battery system is eligible for a property, and the rebate can only be claimed once per property. Only someone with several properties or who moves on to a new residence could potentially install or upgrade multiple batteries under the scheme;
• Batteries can be off-grid or connected to the grid, but in the case of the latter, they must also be Virtual Power Plant (VPP) capable (this doesn't mean battery owners must actually join a VPP);
• Installers are required to be accredited for battery installation by Solar Accreditation Australia (check your preferred installer's status here).

My 20kWh battery may become 50kWh for about $1200 more! My head spins given my last 2 batteries cost me about $10000 each! [biggrin]

Hope above may be of interest to you If you're considering a home battery.

That sounds like FGV which stands for Very Good Value!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RANDLOVER

That sounds like FGV which stands for Very Good Value!

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The FGV is possibly better value than I realized. Just read this

"Under the cap, spot electricity prices can rise to as much as $18,600 a megawatt hour, or $18.60 a kilowatt hour.Average retail electricity prices are between 30 cents and 40 cents per kilowatt hour, with a typical household using about 17 kilowatt hours a day.
Since 2019, the market cap has risen from $14,500 a megawatt hour and it is set to jump 16 per cent to $22,800 from July next year.
By 2028, it will be almost $27,000 a megawatt hour."[bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle][bigwhistle] I could have put this in a nuclear thread, A grumpy old tread. In this case its just being prepared thread?

Happy Father's Day to all dads biological or those legends that just chip in and generously help in that role

I have a 6.5 kwh system. It does ok. We have limitation on roof space and shading issues from neighbouring properties.

I was considering getting some ideas about whether it can be improved, but with current FIT I think I'd be better to spend the money on a bigger battery.

Our old AC was a total power hog and it was costing us an extortionate amount of money. We have just had a new AC installed and it would appear it's going to use half the power so I'm keen to see how our usage goes over summer.

It'd be good if you can become an official "Generator" and gets those spike prices. Until about 10 years ago before all the solar really came online, my employer who owned a few buildings with diesel generators would often be paid to run them on hot afternoons, from about 2 to 6pm.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RANDLOVER

It'd be good if you can become an official "Generator" and gets those spike prices. Until about 10 years ago before all the solar really came online, my employer who owned a few buildings with diesel generators would often be paid to run them on hot afternoons, from about 2 to 6pm.

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Amber electric seems to let you sell into the peaks. Which is why it's ideal for people with a good size battery. Their automation manages it.

Unfortunately my solar operates when everyone else's does so if you are on wholesale pricing you might even have to pay to export!

The other downside is unless you have a battery you're going to be paying A LOT during the evening peak for your house electricity. It might work if you somehow don't do normal peak things.. but honestly I can't imagine it would work unless you have a battery.

But I think if you have a battery with enough capacity to cover the evening peak and sell into it then I think it can be quite a good deal. Even if you don't have enough solar and need to top up the battery from the grid. The key thing is you have to be able to cover your peak demand and then some. For us I think 10 would not be worth it.. probably 30 would be ideal.

Saw a Iron Clad assurance that power prices would be cheaper in 2025 made two years or so ago[biggrin] That belongs in Jokes of course now.


My system is sitting out side waiting for installers. While I am waiting I was looking at my 5000w IF/When grid fails. It dropped of yesterday when a car and trailer climbed a power pole almost beside the CFA unit here :)

Startup Wattage Estimates

Appliance Startup Wattage Range
Microwave 1000–1500 watts ]Most microwaves have a consistent draw; startup surge is minimal.
Electric Kettle 1500–3000 watts High draw due to resistive heating element; startup and running wattage are similar.
Induction Cooktop 1800–3000 watts May spike briefly at startup depending on model and pan detection.


In my business over the years I found Laser Printers the worst offenders for killing my systems.

Suspect the 5000VA 21.7A will be fine as I no longer have several Laser printers [biggrin] Growatt settings for its default fun seem ok to me

"Grid-connected Mode When the SPH operates in Grid-connected Mode, users can set appropriate working mode as needed. When configuring on the LCD screen with the buttons, you can only set the working mode for one time segment. When configuring on the website of the datalogger, you can configure the working mode for up to three time segments (for details, you can refer to Section 6.1.2.4).

1. Load First: Load First is the default mode. In this mode, PV energy is prioritized for supplying loads and the surplus solar power will be directed to charge the battery. The further excess power (if any) can be fed to the grid, subject to the Export Limitation settings. If PV energy is insufficient, the battery will discharge to power the loads. If the battery discharges to the user-defined discharge cutoff SOC, it will draw power from the grid to support the loads.

2. Battery First: In this mode, the PV power is sent to charge the battery first, suitable for periods of low electricity tariff. You need to set the start and end time for this mode, and the battery charging cutoff SOC. You can set power levels below the inverter's maximum charging power. If AC CHG (charge from grid) is disabled, the inverter will charge the battery with the PV power as much as possible, and send the surplus power to the loads. The further excess power will be exported to the grid based on the Export Limitation settings. If enabled, the inverter will charge the battery with the solar power first; if insufficient, it will draw power from the grid to support the loads.

3. Grid First: In this mode, PV energy will be primarily fed into the grid, suitable for periods with high electricity tariff. You need to set the start and end time for this mode, and the battery discharge cutoff SOC. Users can set power levels below the battery's maximum output power.


Off-grid Mode If the grid power fails, the system will automatically switch to Off-grid Mode (you can disable this feature, referring to section 6.1.2.4), and output AC power with the solar and battery energy via the EPS port. If PV power is not available, then only the battery will discharge."


Proof of this will be IF I don't notice anything and pay a lot less soon. I will disable grid export as I can pump all spare power into my car.

The two flow batteries I had for vaccine fridges and more were BIG. 20kWh for both of them was welcome when they didn't need replacing under warranty again a few times before that Aussie company went RIP.

The 30kWh and inverter sitting just waiting for rails for the last two solar panels to go up are tiny and pretty smick compared to the prior two I had.

Attachment 194692 Its 6 battery modules in two stacks. The far stack has the inverter neatly on top. My prior set up beside the Batteries, Had a Fronius Inverter and two Victron Quattro 48/8000 chargers which controlled everything. Like the service fuel and maintenance on my Disco I won't mention how much the rest of that prior set up cost and saved me at times. [bigrolf]

My new system will allow power if/when grid fails





The controls are interesting. I do not need a very helpful sparky to manage this I think

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n61flVwpEMc


Proof of the pudding will be reliability and longevity of course. The above including 6.6kWh of Solar and installation costing me under 10k after all the subsidies is a bit shocking to myself.

I am now out of gas for heating, cooling and cooking. Noting before anyone gets funny about that - All my Warships had no gas for cooking and AC. Hot water or all fresh water was directly or indirectly via the BLOODY big boilers of course[biggrin].

The Induction Cook top rocks in my kitchen and for my new BBQ/Camping (not backpacking [biggrin][biggrin][biggrin]) Cleaning my gas cooktops has been a PITA at times . With an Induction Cook top only the surface directly under the pan gets warm so not backed on spills. grease makes it a simple wipe on the flat glass surface. It is really the game changer, I think. Steaks and fish on my cast-iron pan at exactly the temp I want are perfect every time.

Prawn and scallops last night [thumbsupbig][thumbsupbig][thumbsupbig]

This was super easy as well. Asian Chilli Garlic Prawns (Shrimp) - RecipeTin Eats

I cannot understand why we are using lithium batteries for home and commercial applications.

We already know that if all cars transition to electric there will not be enough resources to build the batteries and there is a hope that battery technology will improve to save the day.

As we all know the main advantage of lithium batteries is high power, large capacity for relative light weight and reasonable cost. This makes them great for mobile applications like cars, planes etc.

However why do houses need this technology where space and weight is not really and issue, and indeed high efficiency is not needed as much as mobile applications. So why with limited resources are lithium batteries being used in static applications. Why do we not continue to use the latest lead application batteries in home situations. Sure - much heavier, not as powerful, but much cheaper and a big bank of old style batteries does not look as nice as a lithium banks sitting on the garage wall.

So is the use of lithium batteries in home application more to do with fashion and trendiness rather than demonstrated need.

Garry