Thread: Heart vs. Head? (Defender or Rubicon?)

Originally Posted by 2 rocks

Ah well...none of which helps Sleepy...

Nah, This is great Mike. I really appreciate the input.
I have always thought the Defender had no competetion. I am not convinced anymore.

Image - I think I'm old enough that I dont give a rats knacker about what people think. If people think I'm a w@nker - let them - I proabably aint gonna change their opinion. (Geez I owned a Lada Niva once I know what it's like!!) Does it make me smile?
Eng/Trans - I think the J**P stacks up ok. Auto, more power/torque in both engines etc. But stats are stats and they mean nothing if you can't get this on the ground.
Wheels - The Rubicon has 17" standard, that doesn't impress me, I think I'd downgrade to 16" as the rubber is cheaper and more options. I'm not into huge rubber just for looks. My 235/85's have done a fine job. Even run 7.50x16 XZL's on 130 rims as my "off road" wheels. (Yeah I don't drive extreme - high country rambling is more my style)
Suspension - Mmmm this has been raised a couple of times and I am very very happy with my standard suspended LR (This factor could be the decider ) All the power in the world is no good if your wheels are lifting off the ground.
Gearing - This is why I was first attracted to the Rubi it has a much lower ratio than the other Wranglers and also has difflock F+R, heavy duty diffs and disconnecting sway bars. (All sounds good but....). No diesel available in the Rubi.
Looks - The defender wins this hands down - even with the swollen bonnet The J**P is OK. (Bit too much plastic??)I like the removable roof.
Ground Clearance - Well, I agree the J**P looks lower and proabably is. But then again I drove a Subaru Brumby up the telegraph track and didn't scrape it too much. (Proably need to raise J**P an inch or two though).Has lots of protection plates
SWB or LWB: The rubicon is avbl as a 2 door as well so would be an equivalent for the D90 . (WHich LR say they aren't doing any more but ....stay tuned.)
Durability - Is it tough enough? Panhard rods etc. (This is worth checking out - closely!!)
- Don't think J**P drivers do "the wave" do they? I think I'd miss that


Progress Score Heart 13 Head 11 (Including a PM)

Sleepy
Jeep drivers most definitely do do "The Wave" - and just like LR, there is some nefarious protocol to follow - mostly ignored by anyone who gives a damn! Lol! And...Nivas (like Zooks) can shame a lot of much more precious metal.

If you're looking to downsize the rims, remember as with anything, you will need bigger rubber to maintain or increase clearance. Lifts are great for flex but it's rims & rubber that gets the diff up off the ground. Have to say I haven't measured, but don't think there's much between my D2 and the TJ, both on 31's at present. If you ditch the ridiculous ADR compliant front bumper, the JK's approach and departure angles would be hard to fault. Not sure if you're looking at the 2dr or the Unlimited (4dr) so ramp over will be different, but I know the belly plate on my TJ is a PITA, but probably revised on the JK.

Yes the omission of the CRD from the Rubi is shameful. As is the stupid slip yoke (possibly changed on the JK?? I just chucked a slip yoke eliminator on my first TJ to accommodate any lift). Far as I know the Wranglers have amongst the best flex right out of the box. Modding a Wrangler isn't something you "have" to do, but it's fun and the enormous US market means there is a mind boggling array of bits and pieces easily available.

I love both marques, so I wouldn't try to swing you either way. I guess I'm just saying that if you ask a Holden forum what the new Falcon is like, well...what are they going to say?

I'd suggest having a nose around on ausjeepoffroad.com as well, as you might get an idea of what JK owners love/hate about them - and it is likely to be warts and all/real life - just like we complain about the 3 amigos etc, etc here on AULRO.

In the main I've found that there seems to be a mutual respect amongst Landy owners and Jeepers. But maybe this is just the recognition of the fact that we both choose not to have a ToyNiss Whitegoods.

Good hunting!
Cheers
Mike

Good points Mike,

The reason I posted here was I guess I was happy for you-all to drag me back to the Landy. But I also feel that most of us love 4wding too and proabably aren't all as fantatical as we make out. I've owned a spectrum of 4wds and the defender is easily the best.....so far. (Ahh my little Lada was a ripper...when it worked.)

I probably would go for the SWB as I have the Disco for the family and the S11 for that Land Rover "experience". (Do like the 4 door though)

Agree about the rubber question, the 17" are same rolling diameter as the 16". In general the 16" tryes (31's or larger) are proabably easier/cheaper to source. Remembering a 2" bigger tyre only lifts you 1 inch ; Whereas a 2" inch suspension lift is all lift.

Ahh, In the end I just threw the question up to see how it would be shot down. Most input has been constructive and useful and helps me make an informed decision.

And let us not forget what chassis Mr Wilkes built the first centre steer landy on too

Paul
Yes I have to confess to secret, evil thoughts of trading both in on an Unlimited in Rescue Green but I'd miss the green oval too much!

I always wanted one of those yellow & black "Game" 90's but they were too old for what I needed it to do and Shorty Deefers were out of my price range...and I wanted an easy to use hard/soft top combination.

ATB
Mike

I am Lost......

For me

Heart = land rover

head = land rover

are you forgeting just how good these trucks are??

I get to drive nearly every of 4wd there is on the market for work..including JEEPS

There is nothing like a land rover... NOTHING!


theres a reason the Jeep salesman is working so hard at it and being nice.. He has to!

How else will he convince someone to buy a jeep..

Hey Slunnie,

Im pretty sure the rubicon doesn't use a slip yoke.

btw, heres my new toy, very pleased with it and Im not a ******

Its a '99 TJ

Originally Posted by Slunnie

The Rubicon is 73.144:1

Gear Ratios
1st.... 4.46
2nd.... 2.61
3rd.... 1.72
4th.... 1.25
5th.... 1.00
6th.... 0.84
Reverse.... 4.06
Axle Ratio.... 4.10
High Range Ratio.... 1.0:1
Low Range Ratio.... 4.0:1

Pretty impressive hey.

I agree, those figures are impressive.

But.....would engine braking, even with those ratios, with the petrol engine, match that of the Defender?

Originally Posted by numpty

I agree, those figures are impressive.

But.....would engine braking, even with those ratios, with the petrol engine, match that of the Defender?

It may be better!!!

People have been complaining that the anti-stall feature on the defender keeps the revs at 1000rpm or higher, even when going downhill.

AFAIK the jeep idles at about 700rpm.