Thread: Interesting, Odd or Funny Pics.

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Red was adopted when it was important to be able to identify your side in poor visibility in clouds of black powder smoke, and when red was almost the only distinctive colour for which a reasonably cheap dye was available - before this there were no real uniforms - insignia were worn, but were often very hard to see once gunpowder was used extensively.

Close but no Bannana, Henry may have had the red Beefeaters to start with, but with the creation of a parliamentary standing army a army uniform was needed. The sole reason for red being adopted was that it was CHEEP. No other reason, Period
All other reasons became apparent latter, but even some of this is misleading. Red so easly identified on a smoky battlefield? Not true. Red came about before muskets and smoke anyway. The greatest advantage was the Red shoulder to shoulder was Hard for the enemy to count the number of troops you had.

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Khaki was adopted in India in the late 19th century, probably initially temporarily because of a problem with dying cotton red (wool was used for red uniforms but was expensive and hot in India).

Correct, White cotton uniforms were adopted, with the red Tunic becoming a jacket

Originally Posted by JDNSW

The advantages of it for camouflage became apparent as rifling and muzzle velocities improved so that longer range sniping became a factor,

Afghani wars, Kiber pass etc. the British’s troops were unable to form lines so traditional fighting tactics went out the window. Troops/ squads of solders worked together, the forerunner of like the ww1 troop, 1 officer 1 sergeant, 4 Lance, 10 Corporals etc.
Anyway white uniforms stood out like dog balls. So permission was given to die the white in TEA and yes because of sniping

Originally Posted by JDNSW

and it became standard by the time the Boer War started.

Wrong, the first and second Bore war were fought in Red, but with the addition of solders from India and there tea uniforms. Well lets just say the advantages were noticeable.
Kaki was SOP by the 3rd Bore war

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Being seen by the enemy became the major determinant of uniform color with the widespread adoption of rifled artillery and machine guns in the last twenty years of the nineteenth century. This moved the range of engagement out. At the beginning of the nineteenth century, most of the fighting consisted of a single volley at maybe fifty yards or less, followed by engagement using bayonets before either side could reload. By the end of the century, rifled artillery, magazine rifles and machine guns meant that it was no longer important to be able to distinguish the enemy at a glance in hand to hand fighting (which became rare), but being able to see them before they saw you was important.

Nothing wrong with your logic, but you are actually wrong in part. Regardless of uniform a large body of men is hard to camouflage. Camouflage has its advantages in more smaller movements, small groups using care in movement.
We have the example of after the Crimean war, the French returned to there red Pants and blue coats from seeing the advantages for the poms in red. Even the Russians after the Crimean changed back to green from gray. So with a large body of troops which you can not hide you try and confuse. A bit like DAZZLE paint on shipping WW!

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Dark green camouflage uniforms were used by British rifle units during the Peninsular War in the period 1800-15, so the principle of camouflaging troops was certainly known much earlier.

Not British, German

Originally Posted by JDNSW

John

Originally Posted by JDNSW

"German" at that time was not a nationality - and the British king was a German, who was also the Elector of Hanover, so the description of these rifle units as German rather than British is not a real distinction. Many of the troops used by the British against the colonists in the American revolutionary wars were also Germans from, or recruited through, the Kings German possessions, but nobody refers to them as such - and they wore red uniforms as a general rule, the later green uniforms probably resulting from the experience of the army there.

John

100% correct if you are talking about the American war of independence. Even then there was a mix of uniforms with the Hanoverians.
By the time of Napoleon Hanover was independent of the British crown politicly.
The Hanoverians joining the British army was a result of Bonaparte invading Hanover. they hated the bloody frogs so they joined Wellesley, at that time they had there own uniforms. Green over white or red over white or blue over white. they soon got a reputation of being crack troops. With Wellingtons takeover of responsibility and if you know a bit about Wellingtons Ideas, this makes perfect sense. By that time there uniforms were rather shot. Wellington issued new British uniforms. This is well known because there is lots of correspondence about this, basically the Hanoverians wanted to keep there uniforms ( replace) a bit of national pride. Wellington wanted them in red. Since they had such a high fighting reputation Wellington didn’t want to show where they were. The French or Nay being for daring/ blasé. With out sight of the Hanoverians. So you could argue that red was camouflage, hiding in plain site.

What was Wellingtons great achievement, change to the British army ( other than Victory) latter transfered to the Russians?