Disco 4 V Landcruiser Prado

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Originally Posted by Grumndriva

Perhaps you didn't pick up on the bits where I stated what I wanted the vehicle to do: remote area towing of a 2.7 tonne van with a minimum range of 600km.

You suggested I haven't "even seen one, let alone been in one". I thought being in the last stages of making the decision that it would be understood that I have driven both. I have, and neither my wife nor I could pick between them in the comfort stakes. The fully electric front seats (standard in the 200LE) help to make a difference. The slightly better driving position (for me) makes the 200 possibly more comfortable. But neither has a problem. They are both very comfortable vehicles. The D4 may be more comfortable in serious off road work, but I am not proposing to do that. I did try to rent a 200 to see how the comfort held up over a full day in the saddle, but no-one rents them (or the D4) here.

You suggested I had mistaken the reason for Gordon getting new wheels. I hadn't. I was talking about their suitability for remote area work. 19 inch wheels are probably better than the 17s standard on the 200 for towing with their lower sidewalls, but I am not convinced that they are as good for gibbers etc.

The words about my own experience related to the fact that the video tester expressed surprise that the very basic (I think he said agricultural) Prado performed equally as well as the D4 off road. While I was looking at the 200, not the Prado, I had a similar experience. I was also surprised, and I remain so. Perhaps you misunderstood what I meant by experience.

You suggested that the D4 is the best hands down on the road. That might be true for many or even for most users, but if it can't give me the 600 km range with what I want to carry, then sadly the 200 will win hands down for me.

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No mate, got all that, as well as the power & torque and other 'factors' (even though I think the way the 3.0L D4 works negates that concern as the LC is heavier and doesn't (can't) spool as quickly as the D4), was merely focussing on those two points.

I was tongue in cheek when I made the comment about seeing a D4 but they just do not drive like an LC. Your point about driving posi, etc are all valid, I was talking about the whole comfort package. The D4 drives like a big luxury sedan and just eats corrugations, bumps etc. The guy on the video was not exaggerating on how well it does that.

I think the main issue with the 19s with the exception of seriously sharp, really rough stuff (which may chew your rims) is the quality of the tyre. No sidewall strength, so they say.

Not sure where you are going with the agricultural comments, isn't that like saying you'd be surprised that a Deefer can go anywhere a D4 can? I think with the Prado, it's more perception than fact...they are not a Deefer, they just lack the refinement of a D4.

"Equally as well" in pretty easy circumstances has been alluded to......and was clearly stated that they don't get from A to B the same way, they get there...physically....but the D4 does it better. Change tyres and toughen the test and let's see what happens.....It's been clearly stated and alluded to that the Prado is inferior. However, nobody is saying the Prado is crap off-road, we're talking about differences.

One jerry can of fuel???.....you've generated this convo in the past with similar results......are you serious about this activity?

If you are, good luck with the LC, keep us posted.

Cheers.

The LC at 95km/h loaded like you say gets 28-30l per 100

The 2.7 disco towing 2.3t of SharkCat - with bimini up at 115km/h used 15l/100km (The Cat is twice the height of the vehicle)

Was rock solid stable.
Overtook with ample power.

15x6=90 litres
30x6=180 litres

Seems the range doesn't work!!!


Bullbars LR tanks and bumpers:
Any tourer without a bar is crazy so the Tugmota would need one too. And IIRC they are heavier bars.
So basically irrelevant.

Contrary to the myth - Toyotas can NOT be serviced in the bush any better than any other brand.


Now the soap box...
"my grandpa used a WDH and they work etc etc........"
Well they have come a long way since a HR Holden and tear dropper.
Sorry people, old ideas in a new world....

As for "it's a big van and 95km/h is good"
Bull ****e !!!
Vehicles are now far more powerful, stable and capable. Tow at the bloody minimum that a semi travels (100) get over the BS and move at a speed that means your moving WITH the majority of traffic.

And buy a van that's built right.
WDH are no replacement for a poorly engineered shack on wheels.

One Caravan designer at a Van&Camping show actually commented that they 'built the van and then welded the axles where it gave them the right ball weight' when asked how the calculated ball weight.

As for drive it like you stole it driving.
Our mine vehicles are tracked, not a good idea to flog the arse out of them.

We also spin off the 200s from the fleet before 150,000km so we don't wear the fuel system replacement costs.

But I'm done... I'm fed up trying to explain from facts and experience.

Go buy what you want.

If its to tow a lot, get a Light Truck, it will last longer and carry more.

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Originally Posted by Tombie2

As for "it's a big van and 95km/h is good"
Bull ****e !!!
Vehicles are now far more powerful, stable and capable. Tow at the bloody minimum that a semi travels (100) get over the BS and move at a speed that means your moving WITH the majority of traffic.
....

We also spin off the 200s from the fleet before 150,000km so we don't wear the fuel system replacement costs.

But I'm done... I'm fed up trying to explain from facts and experience.

Go buy what you want.

If its to tow a lot, get a Light Truck, it will last longer and carry more.

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Tombie - I think from memory in NSW the max when towing more than 750kg is 90kph. Does the Disco 3/4 handbook say anything about max speed when towing beyond a particular weight?

I agree though that if legal and with in manufacturer's specs towing at the speed limit of 100kph on main highways is sensible if the vehicle and trailer work well at that speed - with a good tow vehicle and a well set up trailer with good electric brakes and good controller it would be better to tow at that versus getting people upset at 90-95.

As for the fuel system in the 200 I have heard that it is huge cost at 150k so having it as a long term proposition is going to be costly.

A light truck...you mean a Defender...now there's an idea:wasntme:

Cheers

As far as I know WA is the only state that limits towing to 90k.

The D4 book states 100k is the max while towing.

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Originally Posted by mowog

As far as I know WA is the only state that limits towing to 90k.

The D4 book states 100k is the max while towing.

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Hehe! Oops.

So overtaking to 140 wasn't a good idea? :)

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Originally Posted by ozscott

Tombie - I think from memory in NSW the max when towing more than 750kg is 90kph. Does the Disco 3/4 handbook say anything about max speed when towing beyond a particular weight?

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just some clarification. other states may be different.
NSW road rules
NSW Legislation

21 Speed limit where a speed limit sign applies

(1) The speed limit applying to a driver for a length of road to which a speed limit sign applies is the number of kilometres per hour indicated by the number on the sign.

Note. Length of road is defined in the Dictionary.

(2) However, if the number on the speed limit sign is over 100 and the driver is driving a vehicle with a GVM over 4.5 tonnes or a vehicle and trailer combination with a GCM over 4.5 tonnes, the speed limit applying to the driver for the length of road is 100 kilometres per hour.

Note 1. Combination and trailer are defined in the Dictionary, vehicle is defined in rule 15, and GCM and GVM are defined in the Act.

Note 2. This subrule is not uniform with the corresponding subrule in rule 21 of the Australian Road Rules</I>. Different rules may apply in other Australian jurisdictions.

cheers phil

Grumndriva, can I just commend you on your behaviour on the forum. A lot of blokes here have been giving you a bit of curry, and you haven't bitten back or lowered the level of the debate.

good stuff, I am reading with interest, and it is interesting to hear your views, as i have just sold a LC100 and am looking at a D4

cheers
lucas

I know this is heresy but in my opinion Grumndriva should just buy a low kilometre 1HDFTE sahara 100series and be done with it.

Less fancy options, great diesel, great range, ****es all over a 200series in so many ways AND every cocky up north & out west has one so they must be good ;)

S

Apart from breaking front suspension the 100 are a very good rig in their own right and the after market stuff for them is fantastic range wise. Some good bargains too. However their payload is ordinary from memory.

Cheers

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Originally Posted by irondoc

Grumndriva, can I just commend you on your behaviour on the forum. A lot of blokes here have been giving you a bit of curry, and you haven't bitten back or lowered the level of the debate.

good stuff, I am reading with interest, and it is interesting to hear your views, as i have just sold a LC100 and am looking at a D4

cheers
lucas

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Yes I agree. Grum is a very helpful member. I dont see any need to give him curry. Its a bit precious to do so frankly.

Cheers