Thread: Disco 4 V Landcruiser Prado

I have to add this. Whilst I have been the recipient of assistance on the D3/4 page, overall the general sense I glean from this part of Aulro is that those with these vehicles are a little more tender than those on the other areas - D1, D2 etc. It does not take much in this area to get belted. I have been on occasions - in fact most of the time I question the new shape vehicle, its systems, abilities, wheels, tyres, etc I get a pasting. Now I am thick skinned and I persevere and get some good advice, but I cant help but feel that any perceived questioning or criticism of the new shape is considered D3/D4 bashing

I think the new shape is an amazing vehicle, but its not without fault and its a very very complex machine and that, naturally, concerns people (me included). Whilst the faults on this site are not legion (park brake, ball joints, turbo issues - in particular loss of power when needed...) they are on the UK site which is a very well patronised site. I also struggle with the concept of 19 inch tyres on ANY offroad vehicle being used offroad for more than pansy work.

I have held off going to the new shape - for 4 reasons, I enjoy the old shape and its reliability to me to date, and its ability off road, I am concerned that for what I do the D2 is hard to beat in towing in deep soft sand (and I have been assured by Gordon in particular that my concerns about this are unfounded - thanks for that) and I own it and finally I hold my vehicles out of warranty and do have concerns about the long terms ownership of the new shape.

Having said that for work purposes I am able to lease a vehicle and this is the longest that I have owned a single vehicle for (ie 9 years this year...) and it works for me to lease (and I am years out of lease now)...so my reasons for holding back and keeping the D2 are not related to the high cost of new large 4wd vehicles (but with the new shape being 2 - 2.5 times the cost of my D2 when I bought it new it does stick in the throat a bit irrespective of a lease and tax implications). But these things ought not see flame comments coming in, and likewise Grum had issues with the D4 and ought not be belted.

I will continue to post in this area, and hopefully do so in a constructive way but I think some lessons could be learned by those new shape Disco owners in reading the D2/D1 thread. I dont want to be too critical, but I just get the impression sometimes that those on here would be quite happy if pesky D2 owners just went away and did their thing on their page and left the D3/4 page alone. That is not in the Aulro spirit as far as I understand it.

In the meantime, thanks for those who have helped me to date, including Gordon who has at times been frustrated by me I think. There may well come a day when I frequent this board after buying the new shape, but I will still help where I can on the other boards.

Cheers

Originally Posted by TerryO

I did say 'by some' Gordon. I didn't say by everyone who took part in the thread, in reality I was trying not to single anyone out for being either helpful or for flaming the man apart from Celtoid who through himself under the bus and admitted it.

Those who played the man instead of the ball know who they are.

cheers,
Terry

Hold the bus, let's not be using my name in vain....

When a man posts a thread that pretty much states...."I've done my research and the D4 is inferior to the LC200 for my purposes"....you've got to expect some scrutiny. When your research amounts to nothing, not once but twice....you have to expect to reap what you sow. Come on Terry...this is ridiculous. At least some of us have tried to explain what the concerns with that approach are.... Some wouldn't give you the time of day on any forum! It has nothing to do with the D4 or any Brand (Toyota, Nissan) whatsoever, it's the concern of not having facts to back anything you say.....twice. And the manner that the statement was presented in didn't help either.

Geez…..

Originally Posted by ozscott

I have to add this. Whilst I have been the recipient of assistance on the D3/4 page, overall the general sense I glean from this part of Aulro is that those with these vehicles are a little more tender than those on the other areas - D1, D2 etc. It does not take much in this area to get belted. I have been on occasions - in fact most of the time I question the new shape vehicle, its systems, abilities, wheels, tyres, etc I get a pasting. Now I am thick skinned and I persevere and get some good advice, but I cant help but feel that any perceived questioning or criticism of the new shape is considered D3/D4 bashing

I think the new shape is an amazing vehicle, but its not without fault and its a very very complex machine and that, naturally, concerns people (me included). Whilst the faults on this site are not legion (park brake, ball joints, turbo issues - in particular loss of power when needed...) they are on the UK site which is a very well patronised site. I also struggle with the concept of 19 inch tyres on ANY offroad vehicle being used offroad for more than pansy work.

I have held off going to the new shape - for 4 reasons, I enjoy the old shape and its reliability to me to date, and its ability off road, I am concerned that for what I do the D2 is hard to beat in towing in deep soft sand (and I have been assured by Gordon in particular that my concerns about this are unfounded - thanks for that) and I own it and finally I hold my vehicles out of warranty and do have concerns about the long terms ownership of the new shape.

Having said that for work purposes I am able to lease a vehicle and this is the longest that I have owned a single vehicle for (ie 9 years this year...) and it works for me to lease (and I am years out of lease now)...so my reasons for holding back and keeping the D2 are not related to the high cost of new large 4wd vehicles (but with the new shape being 2 - 2.5 times the cost of my D2 when I bought it new it does stick in the throat a bit irrespective of a lease and tax implications). But these things ought not see flame comments coming in, and likewise Grum had issues with the D4 and ought not be belted.

I will continue to post in this area, and hopefully do so in a constructive way but I think some lessons could be learned by those new shape Disco owners in reading the D2/D1 thread. I dont want to be too critical, but I just get the impression sometimes that those on here would be quite happy if pesky D2 owners just went away and did their thing on their page and left the D3/4 page alone. That is not in the Aulro spirit as far as I understand it.

In the meantime, thanks for those who have helped me to date, including Gordon who has at times been frustrated by me I think. There may well come a day when I frequent this board after buying the new shape, but I will still help where I can on the other boards.

Cheers

At the end of the day, nobody should have an issue with genuine concerns and I expect most would love to hear of potential issues.

You are right though, many would not want to hear of a flaw in a vehicle that they have spend $'ers on, especially a load of money on..but the same applies to all vehicles, regardless of cost (generally)..but I'm sure they will later, when/or/if they need advice.

However, this whole thread is none of that...in fact originally it was nothing to do with D4 problems at all.

There were no facts presented...."whittled down to nothing at all" was stated...roughly speaking. Nothing wrong with that at all.....but why twice by the same person and why challenge with "My research shows" when there was no such research at all? That's probably what makes people prickly.

I have driven shed loads of Military 110s, Unimogs, 113s and flown many helicopters but would be clueless on real aspects of their ability and specifications.

Would any forum appreciate me stating that my 4WD is better and then rattle off a lot of non-facts? I doubt it?

Can we please get back to business....?

Hi Guys, I must say this has been an interesting thread with some slightly heated discussions.
Like me, alot of D3, D4 owners have owned Landcruisers (I had 3 of them prior to my D3, then D4) and can give their opinion first hand, instead of relying on comments / tests from magazines etc.
Hopefully those making the choice where to spend their hard earned $ have gained valuable information from those in the know.
Cheers, Craig

Originally Posted by Disco4SE

Hi Guys, I must say this has been an interesting thread with some slightly heated discussions.
Like me, alot of D3, D4 owners have owned Landcruisers (I had 3 of them prior to my D3, then D4) and can give their opinion first hand, instead of relying on comments / tests from magazines etc.
Hopefully those making the choice where to spend their hard earned $ have gained valuable information from those in the know.
Cheers, Craig

Finally got around to watching it.

Thanks for posting the link. Most appreciated.

I have bitten my tongue and held off replying to comments on this post but think a post is now in order.

Terry O, I think you've missed the point that some are making here and your comments re people on this forum definitely unfair. It's not that Grumndriva questioned the abilities of the D4 that raised peoples ire, rather that when advice and reason were given he did not acknowledge it. In fact some advice was completely ignored.

Having viewed plenty of other 4x4 forums I think I can safely say that you couldn't get a more helpful, upfront and honest lot than those on this forum.

Entirely agree. Well said!

Originally Posted by ozscott

I have to add this. Whilst I have been the recipient of assistance on the D3/4 page, overall the general sense I glean from this part of Aulro is that those with these vehicles are a little more tender than those on the other areas - D1, D2 etc. It does not take much in this area to get belted.
[SNIP]

....In the meantime, thanks for those who have helped me to date, including Gordon who has at times been frustrated by me I think. There may well come a day when I frequent this board after buying the new shape, but I will still help where I can on the other boards.

Cheers

You think right Andrew old chap But it's not flaming or belting in any sense - go to DiscoWeb or OuterLimits for examples of that! I think Terry's response of "I'm taking my ball and going home" was a little uncalled for - there was nothing that bad said here.

The "tenderness" you perceive is easily explainable. The technology shift these new platforms represent is an order of magnitude greater than any previous LR release. Or any 4WD for that matter. Many things that used to be relevant in the 4WD universe (think WDH, lockers, lifts etc etc) are either irrelevant or have to be thought of in a whole new light. Most seasoned 4WDrivers who have never had a D3/D4/RRS just don't get this. They continually ignore real-world experience from owners because it just doesn't "gel" in their frame of reference, which they understandably thought was justified over decades of learning. And when this is repeated again and again, with no factual basis, it gets "frustrating"

That doesn't happen as much in the other vehicle forums - they have their own specific problems! - and as such, I think this area of AULRO is more of a learning experience than most others.

You are _very_ lucky that you have a D2 that has been relatively trouble-free - it's probably the most unreliable car LR made. And I look forward to you questioning the ability of the D5/D6/D7 to tow in sand for the next decade or two

Cheers,

Gordon