Thread: Won’t be retro...

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

I think they may have deliberately set out to change the D5, for example by changing from square to rounded styling, and open up a gap wide enough for the Defender to fill in various versions.

Very good point, they are far from dumb, they have been ahead of the 4x4 game for 70 years now. From what I've seen new fender will be step up again.

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

I think they may have deliberately set out to change the D5, for example by changing from square to rounded styling, and open up a gap wide enough for the Defender to fill in various versions.

Exactly. As I said earlier.

However in reality I reckon the gap they are planning to fill is that left by the D4, not the Defender. The new Defender will fill the D4 gap well if the camo vehicle images are anything to go by.

But the Defender work vehicle gap remains unfilled at this stage from what we’ve seen IMO. ...unless of course the mule is a disguised D4 shell just used as a PR teaser / for testing driveline and we haven’t actually seen the new Defender body at all!

Originally Posted by blackrangie

Very good point, they are far from dumb, they have been ahead of the 4x4 game for 70 years now. From what I've seen new fender will be step up again.

Beg to differ, LandRover started to lose the game in the mid 70's when Toyota FJ40 began to proliferate and more so in the 80's when they completely dropped the ball & LandCruiser started winning all the Government contracts . Dumb as dog**** comes to mind.

Toyota are king of the 4x4 hill in so many ways & I expect will remain so.

Originally Posted by goingbush

Beg to differ, LandRover started to lose the game in the mid 70's when Toyota FJ40 began to proliferate and more so in the 80's when they completely dropped the ball & LandCruiser started winning all the Government contracts . Dumb as dog**** comes to mind.

Toyota are king of the 4x4 hill in so many ways & I expect will remain so.

I agree.

JLR have been king of luxury SUV tech (although Rivian look to have the jump on them now), which is not the same as the majority 4X4 market.

JLR dropped the serious 4X4 development ball years ago.

Originally Posted by Zeros

I reckon if all they do is make luxury SUV’s they’ll go broke. ...and if thy don’t respect the die hards enough they’ll go broke.

Well I agree if they just concentrate on the top end they will go broke, but the die hard market is nothing and if they aim there they will definitely go broke - they need to meet the middle ground - producing vehicles aimed at the Mums and Dads of the middle classes who wants a vehicle to take the kids to the soccer, drive to work, and head offroad a bit from time to time or just down a country road.

LR learnt that in the late 80s where the 110 was not cutting it, and the RR was moving up market so the Disco was born. They need to relearn this and bring the Disco back to its roots - on the Aussie market for about $60K and these days, a comfortable ute (not a defender style) is needed.

The crusty old Die Hards nearly killed LR once and they will do it again if they have their way.

Garry

Originally Posted by garrycol

Well I agree if they just concentrate on the top end they will go broke, but the die hard market is nothing and if they aim there they will definitely go broke - they need to meet the middle ground - producing vehicles aimed at the Mums and Dads of the middle classes who wants a vehicle to take the kids to the soccer, drive to work, and head offroad a bit from time to time or just down a country road.

LR learnt that in the late 80s where the 110 was not cutting it, and the RR was moving up market so the Disco was born. They need to relearn this and bring the Disco back to its roots - on the Aussie market for about $60K and these days, a comfortable ute (not a defender style) is needed.

The crusty old Die Hards nearly killed LR once and they will do it again if they have their way.

Garry

Yes but as you say, the middle ground soccer mum SUV is Discovery. It’s not Defender.

Discovery has moved further up market. New Defender May fill that gap, but then it’s not really a Defender.

The work vehicle market (Defender) is massive including utes and the full size work vehicle market. It’s not the middle ground. It’s the work vehicle ground. Toyota and Ford dominate this market.

Probably the only thing that will stop them going broke at this point is if they start making 100% Electric right now, Hybrids are a waste of space and weight. They will not claw the Chinese market back any other way. Rest of the world is a drop in the ocean and Australia is nothing at all.

Originally Posted by goingbush

Probably the only thing that will stop them going broke at this point is if they start making 100% Electric right now, Hybrids are a waste of space and weight. They will not claw the Chinese market back any other way. Rest of the world is a drop in the ocean and Australia is nothing at all.

Totally agree - Defender needs to be a HD EV green work vehicle to capture China etc.

Australia needs to play rapid catch up in terms of the fast approaching EV future and networks.

Velar should have been 100% EV and lead vehicle for JLR post 2020.