Thread: The Great LPG Swindle

thanks very much for the considered and, fairly so, varied opinions.
i've just fallen in the door after 2 very long days becoming qualified in the field to operate and maintain a chain-saw (cross-cut), an item which i have never used before in my life. as you can imagine, i'm completely bugga'd. but it does go to show that it is possible for an old dog to learn a new trick and that i'm not a cowboy in any way shape or form. this was a full on, forest industry grade course delivered by bendigo tafe specifically tailored to the otway ranges.

i promise to re-join the debate forthwith but leave you with one initial gambit. the $2000 sum is a fixed sum GRANT and not a REBATE. that is a very important distinction.
meanwhile i shall retire to wash the sweat of my weekend away which, incidentally i've done voluntarily, for nix payment & bring your own food ! (i did say industry quality !)

The felling course is much more fun and prac if you go onto do that as you have already done 90% of the safety stuff required you just get straight into the good stuff.

Congrats on doing the course, Im sure now you see why I harp on about it so much

sorry this update has been a while. ironically i stepped out of the aforementioned shower on sunday only to be called out to a reported smell of lpg at a property adjoining a small industrial estate containing the local RACV and assorted motor trade workshops. that meant 15 people spending 90 minutes scouring for the source of the leak. if i really was having and eating my metaphorical cake i would be paid for that ! how much would a plumber charge for that kind of after hours callout ?
meanwhile i have had my 'case' with lpg australia "reviewed" by some one who signs himself Original Decision Maker so you can guess the result there can't you ? so now i have to apply for further review by an "Authorised Officer" who apparently is "someone who has not been involved with your case before". if i was cynical i'd venture that'll probably be their team member who pulled a sickie last week on the day in question.
i quote from the review letter:

"I made my decision for the following reasons:
The purpose of the scheme is to encourage the use of liquified petroleum gas as a transport fuel. The purpose of the grant is to provide an incentive for prospective buyers of private use vehicles to purchase lpg vehicles or to convert new or used petrol or diesel vehicles to lpg.
As per the Lpg Vehicle Scheme Customer Guidelines:
An eligible vehicle:
Supplying proof of payment for for (sic) the installation of the conversion kit and did not complete the installation yourself"

mmm. maybe i'm getting senile but nowhere in either the february or september version of the guidelines can i find that quote. when you observe the poor editing of the letter the only impression it leaves is that they are simply making this crap up as they go along !
as a voter and taxpayer i am entitled to at least get the ball bowled at me vaguely down the pitch but this mob seem to have mastered at the chapel school of fair play.
so even though i've given up on ever getting my grant i will pursue this whole legislation shambles onwards through the ombudsman in an effort to get some sort of quality assessment audit run over these idiots.

further to yesterday's posting i have now obtained copies of the ministerial guidelines, both current and historical. still no mention of a specific preclusion that excludes the individual from doing work themselves !
i've placed the documents below for reference should you be interested.

meanwhile my personal financial circumstances could now be best described as rooted ! the ironic part is that i am being forced ever closer to swallowing my pride and approaching centrelink for financial assistance. as they are the agency behind lpg australia it makes little sense that they are creating the very hardship that will see me cap in hand at their door.

now if i'd pi$$ed a billion dollars up the wall like eddy groves they'd be all over me like a rash pressing cash into my hands !

LPG Aust obviously havnt recieved a copy of your trade papers as a mechanic/mechanical fitter

macrover, this isn't n.s.w. and therefore, as far as i am aware, there is no requirement for me to have any trade papers in order to carry out mechanical work on a vehicle, commercially or otherwise. obviously any work on the actual gas delivery system is not within my capabilities so that is why i used a 'professional'.

nobody asked to see any 'papers' before i worked on these vehicles:

It certainly seems to me that they are trying to do you over.

I was annoyed when my quote went from $2500 to $3500 overnight. Same components and installation just $1000 more.

A member of this board told me how when his was converted he went into their shop on one quote and when he tried to pick it up they wanted $1000 on top of that quote. That was right when the grant was introduced. He only paid the original quote of course.

I think the grant should be a reimbursement of costs up to $2000 as opposed to $2000 regardless of if it cost you $5 or $5000. However that is not the case so you should be paid the full $2000.

You mentioned somewhere that the instalation needed to be completed by a licenced fitter. Isn't that what happened? You did some and he completed it and signed off on it?
I can understand they would not want to pay someone who fitted it themselves and then applied for the grant without it ever being signed off but that is not what happened here.
Surely your installation is better than the one done by the apprentice and then checked and signed off on by the licence holder.

thanks for the moral support utemad.
so as to make things perfectly clear:
i privately purchased an unregistered parts car from which i took the tank (in date)and mounting hardware, omvl r90 vaporiser, sprintgas electronics box, filler valve and power valve. i also used and fitted the ARB rear bar to mount the filler on. together these cost, as a proportion of the total price paid, about $1300. incidentally i got a gas registered plumber to depressurise and disconnect the components. as he is a fellow firefighter there was no charge for this.
i also bought new an inner wing mounted stop valve and an omvl air meter flap opener. they cost a further $145. i physically fitted all these items into place on my vehicle, taking approximately 5 working days, and using an estimated $50 worth of sundries. at no time was any gas open to the atmosphere nor the electrical circuits connected to 12v.
i then joined the queue for a fitter's appointment. when i finally got one lined up i downloaded a fresh set of forms and guidelines (02/10/08). both these were the feb 2008 dated copies, even though by then they should have been the later ones but obviously the website had not been updated by lpg australia.

my fitter charged me $605 for supplying and fitting all brand new fill/service/delivery lines (both hi and lo pressure), checking the safety of the entire system and starting up and tuning the car. i immediately took the vehicle and paperwork to vic-roads who amended my registration accordingly.

i then went to medicare and lodged the forms for a claim, all duly completed and signed by the gas fitter.

only 20 days later after i telephoned them was i informed my application had been rejected. thats when the problems started. meanwhile the car runs beautifully and having started to use it off road regularly i have since checked all mountings for security.

so all up my costs are $2190, not counting my labour. as a result of my researches on this and other fora i also fitted a new dizzy cap, rotor and spiral wound leads.

well i'm not giving up just yet. i've just received a copy of the accompanying faq's to the newer september 2008 dated guidelines. these would be the documents prepared alongside the new forms and guidelines of course. i wonder why they are dated november ?
nevertheless the two moot phrases previously mysteriously deleted from the guidelines have magically re-appeared in the faq's, namely those referring to second hand parts and converting yourself. BUT, and here's the rub:

"If you do the LPG conversion yourself you are only eligible to apply if you can provide proof of payment for the conversion of your vehicle."

when i offered, by way of a concession to the lpg grants processing department to help them out of their pickle, to provide an invoice from myself to myself for my part of the proceedings that was dismissed out of hand as inadmissable as "it won't have an abn number on it", as was my offer to get my private seller to give a written statement of my having bought the parts from him.
i fail to see what veracity an abn number imbues upon these two documents. neither transaction has any gst implications.

i've attached the new faqs so you can all marvel at the dichotomy of the process. i'm beginning to think that what i previously considered merely poor document preparation is in fact deliberately deceitful in intent.