Exhaust in the coolant

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Originally Posted by peter51

Further to my post - when you research the majority of cases where a p38 owner had a cracked block, no combustion gases were ever detected in the cooling system. The main symptom was loss of coolant, misfiring, and overheating.
I had a cracked block in my first p38 and I tested and retested with my CO2 detector and I never got a positive. Number 4 was steamed cleaned and I was always losing coolant.

A definitive method is to do a leak down check to see if the cooling system becomes pressurised – either by watching for bubbles etc in the overflow bottle, or coolant cascading out of the overflow bottle - or better still fit a temporary cooling system pressure gauge if you have one.
This is the equivalent of a block pressure check if there are no head gasket or valve issues that would affect the leak down.

If you decide it is headgasket you are still better to pull the engine. Dont do the gaskets with the engine in - it will take you twice as long and a lot of fiddly mucking around.
I can remove my p38 engine in 3.5 hours no probs. Anyone can do it. It is an easy engine to work on BTW.

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Hi Mate

I can't keep coolant in the vehicle, on a 30 min drive I lose between 500ml and a Litre :(

The expansion tank and cap have both been replaced so I came to the conclusion it might be exhaust gas in the coolant so I went to have it tested

The car also blows way too much steam once it is hot and is switched off for a while

Steve

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Originally Posted by garybrook

Hi Steve,

and I reckon I've got problems. Sorry to hear of your bad notice. Can you tell me how much TRS charges for testing the gas in the coolant as you did? The reason why I ask is that I was looking about buying a kit at one of the trade suppliers in Canberra. I costs about $140 and it has several tests, but I don't yet know how many I get out of it. I'll ask that when I speak with them next week.

I also understand that several radiator businesses sell that same service so I'll ask their price. Eventually I'll try a test, especially if it gives early advice before a head gasket fails at the back of the block/heads. I thought I may have a problem when my car when the heater matrix leaked - not the o-rings - and considered it could be the head gasket

When I worked it through I thought it was unlikely as the hoses, pressure cap and even the new o-rings were holding the systems pressure, until the heater core broke. At this time it seems to me that the main reason could have been that the reinstalling of the two o-rings either damaged or stressed the core/matrix, which was then nearly 15 years old. I'll have a look when I get it out.

If you intend to rebuild your or another block, are TRS pressure testing the bare block, with or without liners? I know it's a bit of a fiddle but I seem to have read that someone has done this in Australia, as well as others in the UK and the USA.

Lastly, Steve I should say that I admired your work on your earlier and later cars. If I did that much done in that time I'd consider I may be looking for a psych assessment - sort of O/C if you understand what I'm saying - but I'm obviously rather lazy in comparison. Cheers,

Gary (another one)

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Hi Mate

Thanks for your kind comments .. I am feeling a little pain though I always expected that the motor would need an overhaul eventually though not as quickly as this !

I took the car to a local garage and they did the test for $20.00, he was going to do a pressure test as well but the leakage test was instant (he said he had never seen one change colour instantly like mine did) so we didn't bother with the pressure test.

TRS says their reco long engines have been fully tested and rebuilt with new bearings, billet cam etc. I intend to ask a lot more questions before I take the plunge!

Steve

Hi mate

No LPG on this one yet.

Yes there is pressure if I run the car for a few minutes and it holds some pressure overnight now, after the new genuine cap was fitted.

I got it tested because I lose between 500ml and 1 litre of coolant in about a 30 min drive

Plugs are coming out tomorrow and a compression test and leakdown test is in order!

Steve

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Originally Posted by Disco Muppet

X2 on not trusting them...
As per the test mentioned above RE HG vs Cracked block. See which of your pistons has had a trip to the cleaners...

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Thanks mate, i recognise that "muppet" handle :p

Steve

I intend to do more testing, but if the recon motors are indeed reliable then that may still be my best option.

My current engine definitely suffers from shopping trolley syndrome, a peek into the oil filler shows a fair amount of deposits.

Also I am sure the cam is probably worn so as well as a head gasket I would be looking at getting the heads done, replacing the cam, rockers, followers etc and the timing chain and gears.

And then I still have the original bottom end as well

So by the time I add all that up it starts to approach 3K without the hours I will need to spend to do the overhaul.

So a recond engine looks fairly attractive when all is taken into consideration

Steve

Thanks mate, there is no tapping or knocking when up to temp except for a bit of lifter rattle

Thanks for the tip on TRS, I was going to ask that question !

Steve

I also have a borescope camera which I will use as well tomorrow

Steve

For a leak like that I reckon it is head gasket. Anyway you will know soon enough. When you pull the plugs the first part of the puzzle will be revealed.

however - Assume no3 piston is steam cleaned. Its compression should be lower. The others should be about 150 for a low compression engine like yours. Then start the leakdown there. With overflow bottle topped off and cap off you should see leakage.

First thing you can try is block sealer. It really works but is temporary and can suddenly leave you stranded. I drove my 1996 p38 for a year like that, which gave me time to gather my thoughts and a spare block etc. I saw no deposits in the radiator etc.

You can fit a single top hat liner and keep you original block. Of course you dont do that unless the block is thoroughly pressure tested by a quality engine shop.
The beauty of that is you can refit all your current parts, and replace all the seals etc.
If it is head gasket and the heads are skimmed you need to carefully do the lifter preloads. You need to ask the engine shop how they intend to do that having forearmed yourself with the correct technique via AULRO. Be careful here otherwise you will end up with a ticking engine.

Overall they are still an amazing vehicle - so stick with it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by peter51

For a leak like that I reckon it is head gasket. Anyway you will know soon enough. When you pull the plugs the first part of the puzzle will be revealed.

however - Assume no3 piston is steam cleaned. Its compression should be lower. The others should be about 150 for a low compression engine like yours. Then start the leakdown there. With overflow bottle topped off and cap off you should see leakage.

First thing you can try is block sealer. It really works but is temporary and can suddenly leave you stranded. I drove my 1996 p38 for a year like that, which gave me time to gather my thoughts and a spare block etc. I saw no deposits in the radiator etc.

You can fit a single top hat liner and keep you original block. Of course you dont do that unless the block is thoroughly pressure tested by a quality engine shop.
The beauty of that is you can refit all your current parts, and replace all the seals etc.
If it is head gasket and the heads are skimmed you need to carefully do the lifter preloads. You need to ask the engine shop how they intend to do that having forearmed yourself with the correct technique via AULRO. Be careful here otherwise you will end up with a ticking engine.

Overall they are still an amazing vehicle - so stick with it.

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Thanks Pete

We shall see how it plays out, my current thinking is to send the heads out to a pro to get them done, 'Headwerk" in West Gosford has been recommended, then I will do the rest of the work myself with my mechanic mate

Given the engine has had regular service and oil changes, chances are the bottom end is in pretty good shape

So heads, cam, followers, rockers, pushrods and timing chain are the obvious things to do once the heads are off. Not sure about the timing gears they should probably be ok though.

Steve

OK good idea. I have a lot more info on the pitfalls and what to look out for etc. I can send you a link to my file. The Pdf and pictures form too large a file to post 4.7MB It gives a blow by blow description of how to get the engine in and out easily plus lots of other stuff to look out for. My engine is a 59D later 4.6 - so some of it wont be relevant. Have a look at some of my other posts. Ive done four engines removals so far!! It keeps me out of the kitchen.

When u get your block, check it is flat to within .002 inch. Same with the heads when you get them back. Your heads should not be surfaced more than 5 thou really. See how you go.

watch out for poor parts such as Britpart and you should rebuild the rockers if you already have noise. I spent hours trying to get rid of noise on a teardown only to find it was a rocker set and not lifters. I used Bearmach and they are good so far with no loss of oil pressure - top end components control oil pressure the most in an open system.
Enjoy.