Thread: legal seating??

If it is 1976 wagon sold through Leyland Australia, not a private import, then it had the rear longitudinal folding seats as standard equipment. These were considered a 10 seater. I cant remember if they had a cobweb of seat belts in the rear though. The usual 6 lateral seats did have belts to all positions as required by the ADR's.

These were a 12 seater in the UK as this many seats brought the vehicle into a more favourable sales tax classification. In Australia they were a 10 seater as some states required a bus licence to drive a 12 seater.

Qld. Transport say it is OK to temporarily remove seats, but a permanent removal requires a mod plate to eflect the new seating capacity. Conversely, if you get a mod plate and later refit the seats, then another mod plate is required to reflect the change. So, if challenged, say you have "temporarily" removed the seats and it is your intention to refit them when the purpose for removal is no longer required.

Hey Brian, I know of one guy who got busted big time removing seats from an 8 seater landcruiser when he travelled out west. He took out the extra seats in the back which fold down and drove on a big trip out west every year. Then when he comes back to town he puts the seats back in again. Cops booked him for it several times so for the sake of an $80 mod plate he pulls them out and mods the car for the few months he is out west, then returns to town, puts them in and mods it again. Firewall is full of mod plates (as they legally can't be removed) but is cheaper than a fine each time. He challenged it in court (citing that they were only temporarily removed) but was over ruled (they told him it is the same as temporarily removing your abs brakes or your airbags or something like that) and was slapped with an unroadworthy vehicle defect notice.

Certainly bears thinking about.

I think it becomes an issue if your rego lapses. If it has been registered without seatbelts or with more seats than it should have, and you keep it regoed then you don't have a problem, as soon as you go to re-register it from scratch it needs to comply. Depends on who you go to but in the end it is your liability on the line if you have a crash and someone is injured or killed. CTP and car insurance won't pay and you are financially crippled as a result. Or worse.

I'm not sure what year compliance plates became standard in Australia. My 1975 S3 has one but it is only screwed on, I know a lot of them just have the chassis number stamped somewhere and the ID plate on the dash and no compliance plate under the bonnet. So technically if the comp plate was not on the car you have no record of seating capacity and should be able to rego it with whatever it has. You can't do a REVS check if it doesn't have a VIN so there would be no way to check through Qld transport what it had before. Mine was regoed as a class 1 (4 seater or above), but is only a 3 seater.

Sorry pfillery, but there is so much misinformation in this thread - it's astounding.

Originally Posted by pfillery

Hey Brian, I know of one guy who got busted big time removing seats from an 8 seater landcruiser when he travelled out west. He took out the extra seats in the back which fold down and drove on a big trip out west every year. Then when he comes back to town he puts the seats back in again. Cops booked him for it several times so for the sake of an $80 mod plate he pulls them out and mods the car for the few months he is out west, then returns to town, puts them in and mods it again. Firewall is full of mod plates (as they legally can't be removed) but is cheaper than a fine each time. He challenged it in court (citing that they were only temporarily removed) but was over ruled (they told him it is the same as temporarily removing your abs brakes or your airbags or something like that) and was slapped with an unroadworthy vehicle defect notice.

Certainly bears thinking about.

Do you actually know him, or "know of" the story?
Was this in Qld? If so - he needs a better solicitor.
He was keeping within the legislation and regs. as Brian pointed out.
Guideline is here:
http://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/~/media/a1143ca0-be74-4886-90ad-1d1da4bae9c3/vsil50permanentandtemporaryremovalofseatsfromlight motorvehicles.pdf

Originally Posted by pfillery

I'm not sure what year compliance plates became standard in Australia.

1972

Originally Posted by pfillery

My 1975 S3 has one but it is only screwed on, I know a lot of them just have the chassis number stamped somewhere and the ID plate on the dash and no compliance plate under the bonnet.

It has to be rivetted on by law, and legally they are NEVER supposed to be removed/refitted. If screwed in, it's been removed previously and you can get pinged.
There are certain info that a compliance plate has, including chassis no., seating capacity, comp.date, reg no's.
If it doesn't have a compliance plate, it's ether pre 72 or it's been removed.

Originally Posted by pfillery

So technically if the comp plate was not on the car you have no record of seating capacity and should be able to rego it with whatever it has.

Wrong! If it's post 72 and doesn't have a compliance plate, you will be hard up to EVER register it. Otherwise you need, full engineers report, evidence of previous rego and a whole load of other hoops to jump through. Post 72, or previously registered pre72 will have seating capacity on the system.

Originally Posted by pfillery

You can't do a REVS check if it doesn't have a VIN so there would be no way to check through Qld transport what it had before.

A REVS check tells you nothing of the sort. QT will have previous rego details showing last registration, including chassis, engine #, seating capacity.

Originally Posted by pfillery

Mine was regoed as a class 1 (4 seater or above), but is only a 3 seater.

Class 1 has got nothing to do with seating capacity.
Class 1 is a CTP insurance class for cars and wagons, Class 6 is for utes.
A class 1 can have 1 to 11 seats.

Here endeth the lesson.

pffillery he would have got booked in the cruiser if he removed the belts as the load area seats in both the cruiser and prado are designed to be removed by two clips. Removing seat belt points does require a mod cert. in nsw.

my brand new qld rego'ed vw caddy panel van only has 2 seats

the rego says seating capacity 5

you can put a bench seat in it that takes 3 people but it is not fitted to this one...

i went and picked it up today it does have seatbelts in the rear, but the plate in the engine bay says seating capacity 3? but it has 7 seats inside, and the decals up the side is "safari"with tiger stripe strip,

also i have a series 2a wreck with a 202 engine in it would this be all i need to put a 202 into my series 3?

Originally Posted by skez

i went and picked it up today it does have seatbelts in the rear, but the plate in the engine bay says seating capacity 3? but it has 7 seats inside, and the decals up the side is "safari"with tiger stripe strip,

Pics where are they?!!