DeanoH's Defender

[DeanoH]

The story so far

Bought a 1995 130 single cab 300 Tdi ex 'farm ute'. pretty run down but no obvious major issues.



Engine flush, new oil, filters etc., fix lights (originally none working), new steering arm ball joint, upper panhard rubber and bolt, tighten steering uni pinch bolt, replace rear axle ball joint and upper 'A frame' arm bolts and ready for a test run.

Half hour run on windy dirt roads, skite to brother in law about 'new' Landy. All good so far handles well and plenty of go, until the return trip.
On the return trip major power loss in fits and spurts becoming more frequent a time goes on. Low fuel/sucking air?, fuel gauge shows just below half and put 15 litres in prior to run, so don't think so. Blowing smoke when 'low power', seems to be grey/blue can't really tell as approaching dusk and concentrating on windy road but definitely smoking. Didn't think I'd make it home but did. Straight into shed.
Nothing obviously broken, BUT intermittent rattling? noise in neutral with clutch released, goes away when depress clutch pedal or when increase revs ? Strange, at first discount as minor clutch issue to work out later but not so sure. A bit hard to isolate noise, reasonably loud and engine 'shuddering', like missing, when happening. Not knocking scarry bearing engine about to blow up noise but definitely not supposed to be there.
Crook turbo ?, I've never had a crook one before so am guessing.
A bit of diagnostic assistance needed here please.

Deano

[bcj]

did u drain sedimentor, if farm ute might it be full of water or sludge

brett

110 300tdi

[justinc]

The story so far

Bought a 1995 130 single cab 300 Tdi ex 'farm ute'. pretty run down but no obvious major issues.



Engine flush, new oil, filters etc., fix lights (originally none working), new steering arm ball joint, upper panhard rubber and bolt, tighten steering uni pinch bolt, replace rear axle ball joint and upper 'A frame' arm bolts and ready for a test run.

Half hour run on windy dirt roads, skite to brother in law about 'new' Landy. All good so far handles well and plenty of go, until the return trip.
On the return trip major power loss in fits and spurts becoming more frequent a time goes on. Low fuel/sucking air?, fuel gauge shows just below half and put 15 litres in prior to run, so don't think so. Blowing smoke when 'low power', seems to be grey/blue can't really tell as approaching dusk and concentrating on windy road but definitely smoking. Didn't think I'd make it home but did. Straight into shed.
Nothing obviously broken, BUT intermittent rattling? noise in neutral with clutch released, goes away when depress clutch pedal or when increase revs ? Strange, at first discount as minor clutch issue to work out later but not so sure. A bit hard to isolate noise, reasonably loud and engine 'shuddering', like missing, when happening. Not knocking scarry bearing engine about to blow up noise but definitely not supposed to be there.
Crook turbo ?, I've never had a crook one before so am guessing.
A bit of diagnostic assistance needed here please.

Deano

take filler cap off, any excessive pressure?

jc

[Summiitt]

Mmm, clutch noise is probably just a thrust bearing with a little wear in it, my tdi 110 ute has made that noise for the last 70,000odd ks, with no issues, will wait till clutch needs replacing to fix it. As for other noises, could be a crook injector pump, or a fuel issue if the vehicle has been sitting? Pull your new fuel filter off and check if any dirty fuel has been picked up.

[Judo]

From memory blue smoke = burnt oil? (I'm sure JC will correct me if I'm wrong. )

Check dip stick level? Oil getting in somewhere... turbo manifold? head gasket?

[DeanoH]

Thanks for the response, did all of the above, fuel filter OK, a couple of tiny black flecks in good clean diesel, same with sedimenter. No water tank pressure but it was 12 hours later I checked.
Thinking overnight, don't think it's turbo as there would be no boost at idle/fast idle, and it was 'missing' at these speeds after run and parked in shed. I think that makes sense .
Checked water and oil levels. Oil level perfect and crystal clear. Removed intercooler hoses and checked, oily film but not 'wet' with oil.
Water level was down about half a litre but this may not be significant as I'd refilled coolant and hadn't run so may have been air lock settling down, but maybe not. Plastic reservoir tank leaks slightly on seam, but I wouldn't have thought this much.

Possible hairline crack in head?, heats up and sucks water in, would this give major power loss and smoke that may have been steam ? This would have to be on the inlet side of the inlet valve as otherwise compression would blow back into the waterjacket and blow the top off radiator/coolant bottle etc ? No experience here, is this a possibility/probability ?

Anyway started and ran OK this morning, drove a couple of K's with no problem, header tank had pressure but 'normal' I would have said.

Deano

[Judo]

To be honest I'm getting out of my league now, but your comments sounds solid to me.

To be only an issue at hot and "missing" symptoms, does tend to point to head/cylinder. I hear TDI's "run hot", but I can tell you when I broke down with head gasket problems (in Gippsland actually), I could not get the engine to overheat, run hot or show any signs of a problem by revving it while stationary. I had to be driving for a few kms before it got hot enough to be an issue.

If you think coolant is escaping within the head, then I can't see how air pressure wouldn't be going back into the coolant lines. Therefore:

You can leave the expansion tank cap off, rev the engine by hand at the engine bay and watch for bubbles in the expansion tank. Normal conditions, coolant continuously bubbles back into the tank, but NOT air. If there is air bubbling up in the expansion tank, you've found a problem.

**DO THIS COLD** You could also unscrew the top plug on the thermostat housing and see if coolant is flush to the top, or if there is air. Someone else can comment if you're able to do this while the engine is warm, but I suspect that's a bad idea!



P.S. Header tank by workshop manual has up to 15 psi pressure (which is quite a bit I think!). So it is normal to have some pressure there after running for a while.

[DeanoH]

To be honest I'm getting out of my league now, but your comments sounds solid to me.

Thanks for the response, and for my money 'a REAL expert is one who knows their limitations' and isn't afraid to admit it.

T

If you think coolant is escaping within the head, then I can't see how air pressure wouldn't be going back into the coolant lines. Therefore:

I havn't had much to do with diesel engines, let alone intercooled turbo ones over the years but plenty to do with petrol engines. I never even considered a cracked head last night otherwise I would have done as you suggest.
What you understand about coolant into combustion chamber / pressure into waterjacket as a two way street holds true if the 'leak' is into the combustion chamber.
If the 'leak' is in the space before the inlet valve then symptoms can be a bit different. When the inlet valve is open coolant is sucked into the combustion chamber by a mixture of the water jacket pressure (15psi) forcing coolant into the manifold space combined with the action of the downward moving piston sucking the coolant in. On the compression, firing and exhaust stroke the inlet valve is closed thus preventing / limiting pressurising of the water jacket.
Not all that uncommon in petrol engines but I've no comparable experience with intercooled turbo diesels but can't see why this cannot be the case.
Not that I'm hoping it is mind you.

Deano

[Judo]

Thanks for the response, and for my money 'a REAL expert is one who knows their limitations' and isn't afraid to admit it.

And after so much discussion now, I'm really curious to find out what the problem is!

I havn't had much to do with diesel engines, let alone intercooled turbo ones over the years but plenty to do with petrol engines. I never even considered a cracked head last night otherwise I would have done as you suggest.
What you understand about coolant into combustion chamber / pressure into waterjacket as a two way street holds true if the 'leak' is into the combustion chamber.
If the 'leak' is in the space before the inlet valve then symptoms can be a bit different. When the inlet valve is open coolant is sucked into the combustion chamber by a mixture of the water jacket pressure (15psi) forcing coolant into the manifold space combined with the action of the downward moving piston sucking the coolant in. On the compression, firing and exhaust stroke the inlet valve is closed thus preventing / limiting pressurising of the water jacket.
Not all that uncommon in petrol engines but I've no comparable experience with intercooled turbo diesels but can't see why this cannot be the case.
Not that I'm hoping it is mind you.

Deano

OK, makes sense. Not sure how to troubleshoot that one! I guess that means the only place you can look for coolant is in the cylinder and the exhaust? Take an injector out and turn the engine over? Look for coolant in the exhaust? Maybe not....

My knowledge has been exhausted.

[Judo]

Ahhhhhh what the hell, I'll have a crack.

Disconnect fuel solenoid.
Take exhaust blanking plate off. (Where EGT gauge's are installed on a 300TDI)
Turn engine over with ignition.
Check exhaust for liquid.