Failed IRD photo's

[Junosi]

So I thought I'd take my IRD (intermediate reduction drive) apart today to see if it was going to be a simple matter of replacing my crown wheel and pinion. Apparently that's the common thing to fail in the IRD when its been driven around with a knackered viscous coupling for any length of time.

Well the good news is my crown wheel and pinion are perfect - like new even !

The bad news is most of the other gears in there are past their prime... (I bought the car like this, I didn't do this to it honest)

Warning ! - graphic images follow

Stripped gears



Metal shards - small sample of the shrapnel inside the IRD


'Saw tooth' tyre wear - if your tyres wear like this you're doing it wrong...


Guess I'm in the market for a used IRD ...

Also a note for anyone else planning on their own IRD removal - do yourself a favour and remove the cross bar support - its only held on by about 10 bolts and takes about 15-30 mins to drop off - makes life a LOT easier

Clark

[101RRS]

Have you tested the VC to see if it has actually seized up - what part of the IRD are those stripped gears off?

Normally when the IRD fails it is the bearings in the crown and pinion that fail which allow the pinion and crown teeth to become unmeshed. If you are lucky no metal or teeth are lost - just a lot of noise and vibration.

The teeth in the pics looks like it is in the actual front diff section of the IRD rather than the rear PTO section.

Garry

[Junosi]

Yep the VC was seized solid and is off the car now - its the seized VC that causes the 'saw tooth' wear pattern on the rear tyres apparently - my saw tooth was extreme, down to steel wires in the tyre in places.

The pic with all the teeth missing is the big gear beside the front diff - you can see the diff gears just to the right in the photo that join that shaft to the right hand side CV - the diff part appears fine. It meshes with the gear you can see through the oil fill hole, which is also pretty beaten up although not as bad as the one in the photo. Rear PTO parts all look fine, shame really as its the front part I was hoping would be ok and didn't care about the rear so much Possible to make the Flandy a rear wheel drive car you think ? - front is definitely out of action

[Junosi]

Anyone have an old (dead) IRD they'd like to part with (preferably around Melb) ?

I don't know that I can justify spending lots of $$$ on a working IRD for my beaten up old girl =/ So considering frankensteining the good rear drive parts from my IRD with good front drive parts from another to create a working whole - or at least front. Its either that or sell a kidney to get an IRD from a wreckers.

Clark

[johnd]

So I thought I'd take my IRD (intermediate reduction drive) apart today to see if it was going to be a simple matter of replacing my crown wheel and pinion. Apparently that's the common thing to fail in the IRD when its been driven around with a knackered viscous coupling for any length of time.

Well the good news is my crown wheel and pinion are perfect - like new even !

The bad news is most of the other gears in there are past their prime... (I bought the car like this, I didn't do this to it honest)

Warning ! - graphic images follow

Stripped gears



Metal shards - small sample of the shrapnel inside the IRD


'Saw tooth' tyre wear - if your tyres wear like this you're doing it wrong...


Guess I'm in the market for a used IRD ...

Also a note for anyone else planning on their own IRD removal - do yourself a favour and remove the cross bar support - its only held on by about 10 bolts and takes about 15-30 mins to drop off - makes life a LOT easier

Clark

great photos! what were the symptoms before you pulled it apart? Mine just makes a low level (volume not pitch) bearing type of noise, primarily on over run. My tyres don't show that wear pattern and I was planning on just doing a bearing job on it - do I need to think a little more critically of what might be inside?

[Junosi]

Unfortunately I bought the car like that so I can't tell you first hand what the symptoms were for this car. I imagine it was making some pretty terrible noises and tight turns or reversing must of been juddery at best. Lots of other members have first hand knowledge of failure, maybe not as dramatic as mine Mine was pretty much a worst case scenario I think - its usually the crown wheel and pinion for the rear drive that fails and they're replaceable. But my point of failure was the main drive for the front which isn't serviceable so I need a new IRD.

What year is yours ? Problem was usually with the early year ones 97-00.

If yours is making bad noises I'd be opening it up and inspecting it for gear damage etc. I'd be putting a bearing kit in it - there's about 8 or 9 bearings in there and when they fail they let the gears *un-mesh* and thats when you get problems - teeth breaking etc. Cheap insurance vs the very expensive replacement cost of these IRD's

If your viscous coupling is still ok then your IRD shouldn't be getting any extra stress from anywhere - but if your viscous is bad then IRD will fail sooner or later. So check out your viscous coupling too if you haven't already.

Garry has dealt with this issue extensively so he might have some pearls of wisdom too.

Clark

[101RRS]

great photos! what were the symptoms before you pulled it apart? Mine just makes a low level (volume not pitch) bearing type of noise, primarily on over run. My tyres don't show that wear pattern and I was planning on just doing a bearing job on it - do I need to think a little more critically of what might be inside?

I wouldn't automatically assume it is the IRD. You have 1CV, 3UJs and two sets of bearings just in the tailshaft - it could be any of these. You need to check that the VC is OK - do a search and you will find. When my VC failed I did not get the saw tooth effect. I am not totally convinced that the damage in Clark's IRD was actually caused by the VC - the damage and loads are taken by the rear PTO - he has damage in the front diff section - not sure what causes that issues.

When the IRD fails - there is a lot of bashing and crashing and a huge sideways vibration from the front end - like a inner CV has failed. The car is not drivable more than about 5kph and the vibration and shaking is too bad.

I would check the components in your tailshaft first - also the mounting for the rear diff is crap and the front rubber mount chews out allowing the diff to touch other things - that could be the cause of the noise - though it usually knocks on trailing throttle. It is a cheap fix if you do it yourself - a new mount is about $100.

Garry

[trentski]

Mines in the shop at the moment with IRD failure like symptons

It will give a loud clunk when reversing on tight lock and feels like it is binding.

They put it up on the hoist and checked all the mounts first and they all looked OK so they swapped in a good Viscous coupling and took it for a drive and symptons still remain. Putting her back on the hoist and will check the IRD oil for metal.

I told him to torch it if the IRD is stuffed