Thread: I've had it.

just get a reco box and use the correct oil, its done 300000km, and for some of that has had the wrong oil in it. I have never heard of using ATF in a manual box, i use Caltex MTF94 which has been made for the Land Rover manual box, however mine is the R380 so not sure on the ones that preceed that. lately i have been using Valovoline gear oil, not the 80w/90 the one under that and its noiser than the Caltex oil was so i am going to swap back when i can get some of the caltex oil.

The difficult thing is that the LT77 since its inception and right up to the current day, Land Rover advise ATF. I've tried the R380 MTF94 fluid and it was a nightmare. Far too notchy and when cold it was impossible to select gears. Service history shows that it has always had Mobil ATF 210 from new, then Mobil ATF 11E which superseded ATF 210, so consequently it has always had the right fluid in it.

The dilemma therefore is finding something of low enough viscosity to be smooth yet something that provides decent protection. I've refilled today with Kubota UDT (Mobil Agri Fluid 424) because it has a KV between ATF and MTF94 and sufficient EP additives and frictional characteristics to protect the thing.

I've done 70 km and it is shifting far better, but the 2-1 problem is still intermittent which leads me to believe it may be the clutch master cyl after all. FWIW I'm going to spend the $250 and replace both master and slave cyls before pulling the box down.

save the $250 the master cylinder can be replaced with a similar sized PBR jobbie from a trailer shop for $80ish from memory and the slave can be sleeved and rebuilt for about $60.

pull em out yourself and then refit the new ones or as a temporary fix if your going to do it anyway bleed the system up using chainsaw bar oil, its rough as guts but it will prove one way or another that the clutch system is the culprit. Bewarned tho If you do this you HAVE to rebuild the clutch hyd system anyway.

Joel,

I have seen your Oil picture, NOT nice.
I would suggest also that it may be the oil pump that has either worn out and is bypassing, or the drive has failed, or more commonly the corrosion protection that LR put on the inside of the box(Literally a paint) has all flaked off and coated the oil pump pickup screen and blocked it= no oil to the pump= no lube to mainshft brgs and synchros except splash only. Not enough.

I always get the gearbox case acid bathed to rid it of this troublesome coating before rebuilding.

I have used ATF in ALL LT77's for all the years I have been working on and rebuilding these, and never had a problem with shift quality or longevity.(Except those with the pre upgraded 2nd synchro hub )

Having said this, I can't comment on high ambient temp protection with ATF, I would assume a 75w85 synthetic or MTF 94 may be better in 40+ degrees.(?)

Oil feed also depends on the ferrobestos bushing/ oil ring in the rear extrension housing, I have seen these blocked up etc aswell causing lack of adequate lube.

Hope it gets sorted OK.


JC

keep us posted,i also found a half circlip in the oil.about 160000km,i now have 250000 and still use atf.just a thought could of the synthetic oil cleaned the "special paint"of the inside of the gearbox and blocked the pump,good luck

Originally Posted by lewy

keep us posted,i also found a half circlip in the oil.about 160000km,i now have 250000 and still use atf.just a thought could of the synthetic oil cleaned the "special paint"of the inside of the gearbox and blocked the pump,good luck

I'm really not sure, no flakes of paint came out in the oil that I drained, nor did the filter have any flakes in either. I just can't understand why this time around there was so many metal particles, it has never been that bad before. It almost beggars belief that a good synthetic ATF could cause greater metal wear than a plain ATF, especially after 4,500 kms! I was intending leaving that in for 20,000 as per the manual, by 20,000 it would have been so heavily laden with metal that it would have resembled mercury!

Originally Posted by justinc

I have seen your Oil picture, NOT nice.
I would suggest also that it may be the oil pump that has either worn out and is bypassing, or the drive has failed, or more commonly the corrosion protection that LR put on the inside of the box(Literally a paint) has all flaked off and coated the oil pump pickup screen and blocked it= no oil to the pump= no lube to mainshft brgs and synchros except splash only. Not enough.

Interesting! It sounds very likely that the pump is not operating correctly given the level of metal wear.

i know this isnt exactly the answer anyone is looking for, but in the T5 manuals in falcons and commodores, when ford were having issues with baulking shifts when using gear oil, they switched to DEXIII ATF and an additive called lubrizol for the 6cyl's but retained a 75/90 gear oil for the V8's.

considering the load you get hauling ~2 tonnes of 4wd around, i think running straight atf is crazy

Originally Posted by Sprint

i know this isnt exactly the answer anyone is looking for, but in the T5 manuals in falcons and commodores, when ford were having issues with baulking shifts when using gear oil, they switched to DEXIII ATF and an additive called lubrizol for the 6cyl's but retained a 75/90 gear oil for the V8's.

considering the load you get hauling ~2 tonnes of 4wd around, i think running straight atf is crazy

I've seen the Lubrizol in penrite guize. http://www.penrite.com.au/files/15YHOQVZLZ/LZ7906.pdf

Got to agree about the load - between the gears hauling 2 tonnes - with hardly any EP additives... plus a little light towing doesn't help.