Thread: Buying a Welder for Newbie

I’ve found E size to be better for what I do, the D size just doesn’t last long enough. Also a pen E has twice the capacity as a D and is only half as much again for a refill - have these for argon and mig mix. I have mine through Total Tools as my local Bunnings doesn’t stock what I need, which is a bit of a **** given they are quite a bit cheaper but for the amount I use, all good. Even at $5 a month rental for a D size, you’re better off with the deposit change over scheme IMO. Only 3 1/2 years and you’re in front - most people have their welding equipment much longer that this. Just my 2 cents, but I get the upfront cost of the change over units could be a key factor - I’ve got over $800 tied up in bottles but never have to pay rent on them. Use an E size mig mix about once every 18 months, argon a bit longer. Will get oxygen and acetylene too at some point soon as well.

Originally Posted by Homestar

... I have mine through Total Tools as my local Bunnings doesn’t stock what I need... Only 3 1/2 years and you’re in front...

Interesting your situation and thoughts are similar to mine - for casual user in a few years you're ahead with buy your own - no Bunnings scheme but Total Tools does. Contrast between Total Tools and another company up here that also sells cylinders - Total Tools will refund the deposit if you do not want to remain in the scheme or wish to go up a size whereas the other company says it's your problem, sell them on Ebay/Gumtree etc.

If anticipating a lot of welding I would reactive my account with BOC - they have a low use scheme (I assume introduced to compete with buy your own) - two argon E fills in 12months for $150 being very very much cheaper than buy your own cylinders - but if you don't get through all the gas you either return near full cylinders or pay another $150 for another 12 months (basically rent).

I keep oxy/acet for entertainment or when I need to braze/weld/cut or unstick large bolts on tractors etc. Argon for Al and ArgonCo for thin steel. Otherwise back to coreflux for general steel work.

For long term storage of oxygen get steel tanks, the gas migrates through aluminium ie empty bottle when you come to use it.

i was also not impressed with getting an oxygen cylinder from BOC that could only be opened with an extension and likewise closed. BHP have a safety sheet that says any oxygen that cannot be opened by hand without much effort are a safety hazard and should be removed from site immediately. Will be interesting to see what quality control the swap and go provide.

Originally Posted by workingonit

i was also not impressed with getting an oxygen cylinder from BOC that could only be opened with an extension and likewise closed. BHP have a safety sheet that says any oxygen that cannot be opened by hand without much effort are a safety hazard and should be removed from site immediately. Will be interesting to see what quality control the swap and go provide.

Something has gone wrong there, we have never had a bottle without a hand tap on it for any gas from BOC who supply all of our gasses in both industrial and medical.

Originally Posted by workingonit

For long term storage of oxygen get steel tanks, the gas migrates through aluminium ie empty bottle when you come to use it.

Citation needed.

Originally Posted by Toxic_Avenger

Citation needed.

I was going to teach myself how to use oxy/acet for cutting, welding and brazing.

I bought my first ever oxy and acet cylinders from BOC. I had no understanding of what gas comes in what metal type cylinder. So I accepted the oxygen in aluminium. I thought at the time it might be for OHAS ie far easier to lift than the steel acet.

As would have it the cylinders sat in the shed for more than a year unused.

Had a stubborn bolt on the main output of a slashing unit. Decided I should use the oxy/acet (OA). But found no pressure in the oxygen cylinder. My thought was a slow leak? Full pressure in the acetylene.

Took it back to BOC to complain about what might have been a leaking valve. After learning I was the type of user who would keep cylinders long term he said I really should have been given a steel cylinder. Why I asked? His reply, because the oxygen passes through the aluminium metal over time - aluminium is best for OHAS and frequent refill. Gave me a steel oxygen replacement with no charge. Was he right or wrong? I've not had the same problem since, using steel for oxygen.

Do you have info to the contrary?

Originally Posted by Slunnie

Something has gone wrong there, we have never had a bottle without a hand tap on it for any gas from BOC who supply all of our gasses in both industrial and medical.

Probably was not clear enough. The cylinder came with a valve, as it should. Went to purge the opening before attaching regulator. Just no way could I get the valve open by hand, only with a set of long handled multi-grips (and to close it). Mentioned to BOC when I returned it for a refill and they would look at it. One argument the big players put for not selling bottles is to ensure quality control. My comment is more as safety warning that valves should not be difficult to open.

Originally Posted by workingonit

Do you have info to the contrary?

Nothing other than working in that industry for quite some time. I have never heard such a preposterous claim before... to be perfectly honest, I think the guy who told you that was a complete and utter fool.

Cylinders hold upwards of 200 bar in many cases. If it were in fact porous, chances are it'd be empty for the weeks or months it was transported up to Darwin and sat in storage before it landed in your shed.
It's more likely that the valve seat loosened off through not being closed tight enough, or perhaps even worked loose with some daily or seasonal temperature cycles. In extreme cases, the burst disc can fail and lose all contents- particularly if stored in a really hot environment.

One other thing- Aluminium cylinders will not be permitted in underground mining operations.

Originally Posted by Toxic_Avenger

...Aluminium cylinders will not be permitted in underground mining operations.

Thanks for the possible other reasons.

Curious why aluminium cannot be used underground. I guess that is why there is a steel option?