Defender Rear Axles

**LowRanger** · 11th October 2012, 06:36 AM

Originally Posted by isuzutoo-eh

EDIT: This is regarding front axles so a little bit off topic, I have no experience with this company's rear axles. /EDIT

I didn't say all Keiths axles 'aren't so good' I said 'the axles I have from Keith aren't so good'.

It isn't the bush the dodgy axles won't fit through, its the swivel ball they don't fit. Some bloody genius idea it is to sell axles that are too fat to fit through the swivel.
'Guaranteed not to break' by making them bigger till they don't break isn't rocket science it's primitive thought, I'd rather have them fit their intended purpose than indestructible.

So my axles are stuck in place, the CVs can't be removed, if something else breaks (guarantee it won't be the axle...duh) such as the diff again, I can't remove said axle to limp home, just have to let it flail around wrecking everything else. TerryO could confirm they can't be withdrawn through the swivel too, that was after they were installed by a diff specialist, so can't even blame my ham-fisted mechanicing that time.

Keith palmed me off saying the wear won't affect the strength of the axles and the swivels are easily machined out without reducing strength, all I need is a big press to remove the axles. I don't have a big press, access to a big press, desire to smash some genuine AEU2522 CVs that I can't afford to replace to get said axles out the shallow way as the place with a big press I talked to suggested... (they refused to do the job anyway)

No doubt they are a great product to the vast majority, maybe I just have that rare set of tolerances that become an interference fit. It doesn't make me a happy customer. I took it up with Keith, got fobbed off. Really, a millimetre less diameter would have been adequate clearance and according to Keith himself (after showing pictures of how mine have worn at the swivel interference), a millimetre less diameter wouldn't affect the axle's redundant unbreakability.

I'm not the only one that finds that they aren't a 100% product though:
Problem fitting Rovertracks Axles - Ideas?

I feel like I'm channeling Ron's luck with buying parts for my County.

Strange that the 2 vehicles that have had problems fitting the axles have been early 110's.The axles seem to fit Defenders without a problem.
So unless you bashed the shafts in when you replaced the front housing,the axles and CV's can be removed,as we had them out,when we pulled it all apart in my front yard??Also seeing how hard it was trying to fit axles to a bent front housing,I still think that a slightly bent housing may still be the root cause of a lot of the problems.The ISUZU tends to put a lot of weight on the front end.

**rick130** · 11th October 2012, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by LowRanger

[snip]

These were replace a long time ago with a set of Hi Tuff X series axles from Hi Tough,and touch wood I haven't had any problems yet.

[snip]

Interestingly Paula (Storey) suggested the X axles when I bought my first set nearly eleven years ago and the reasons why they should be better/last longer.

**uninformed** · 11th October 2012, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by LowRanger

Serg
You have me a little confused

Why would you think that my rear Salisbury is out of true? Because I had twisted splines on a set of rear Maxi axles?These were replace a long time ago with a set of Hi Tuff X series axles from Hi Tough,and touch wood I haven't had any problems yet.If the housing was "out of true" I would have had problems by now,and they wouldn't have been twisted splines

And I haven't mentioned the salisbury being the strongest?????????

all good mate, I was more making fun of the finger pointing, with a little tech thrown in....There would be more out of true Sals running around than we possibly know. I was thinking there may have been a slight chance that your original MD axles had done twice the time and miles as your new Hi-tough, and therefore not quite an accurate comparrison. But it sounds as thats not the case.

Regarding the Sals=strongest comment, well with 78 different threads going, all covering the same rubbish, errrr I mean tech, I did get cross pollenated as it were

"I run Hi Tough shafts in the rear only.I have already twisted the splines on a set of the old Maxi drive shafts,and they are Salisbury shafts,so a lot stronger as standard."

was you statement in Chooks memebers ride thread. I made the leap from stronger to strongest. But if we look at it, and disregarding the odd 23 spline 101 axles, and maybe even the ENV axles.....I think the stock Sals rear axles maybe be LR strongest. This being, that in a coil sprung housing, the shafts are longest, therefore better for twist/shock load and being 24 spline, they are the biggest major/minor dia.

But then we could throw the old material argument in the pot, where I think I read somewhere that maybe Ashcroft or such proved that the old 10 splines were as strong or a touch stronger than some of the later 24 spline axles .....and only due to LR shifting materials....or it could have been a dodgy heat treated batch.

The variables are endless.

For some of us, OEM will be fine. For others not worth the risk. Rovering Tracks, Ashcroft and Hi-tough all make good shafts.

IMO Hy-tuf being the pick, and on par with 4340-300m. Both these being better than 4340.

For the ultimate shaft, maybe contact "Lara" and see if he is willing to sort some more of his 300 Maraging shafts made by the same people that do Williams F1 stuff. BUt you better have deep pockets....can someone say $10,000 for 4 shafts

, Oh and while you are at it, get him to make some more cranks, rods and pistons for your own 2.7ltr Td5

**rick130** · 11th October 2012, 05:25 PM

Originally Posted by uninformed

[snip]

For the ultimate shaft, maybe contact "Lara" and see if he is willing to sort some more of his 300 Maraging shafts made by the same people that do Williams F1 stuff. BUt you better have deep pockets....can someone say $10,000 for 4 shafts

, Oh and while you are at it, get him to make some more cranks, rods and pistons for your own 2.7ltr Td5

Funny you should mention that.

I only found that thread on Pirate at some ungodly hour last night and read it right through

**uninformed** · 11th October 2012, 06:13 PM

yes that was a little bit of a train wreck....typical Yanks, couldnt think outside their bubble

**LowRanger** · 11th October 2012, 06:48 PM

Serg
The point regarding the Salisbury being stronger,refers to the fact,than in real world applications,the Salisbury axles as fitted as standard,will put up with a lot more abuse than those fitted to normal rover rear end.So although the differences may only be small,there is obviously enough difference to be of added benefit.This is not just from my experience,as over the years,I have heard and seen hundreds of people make the same statement.
There will always be arguments over which is better,as people have their own different use for their vehicles,and others have an affinity towards manufacturers that may be local,others that require something that may last a very long time,but may not necessarily be the strongest,others that require the strongest at the expense of longevity.And then there are those that shop by price,and those that will only buy local.It is a big market and there are choices for everyone,it just makes me laugh when people come out and categorically declare something as "the best"

**weeds** · 11th October 2012, 07:14 PM

what have you decided to go with Will.........

**uninformed** · 11th October 2012, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by LowRanger

Serg
The point regarding the Salisbury being stronger,refers to the fact,than in real world applications,the Salisbury axles as fitted as standard,will put up with a lot more abuse than those fitted to normal rover rear end.So although the differences may only be small,there is obviously enough difference to be of added benefit.This is not just from my experience,as over the years,I have heard and seen hundreds of people make the same statement.
....................."

It can be debated which housing is stronger in stock form. I have been told of plenty of bent/broken Sals as those fitted to pre defender 110's fitted with load levellers.....

what is pretty much a no brainer are the shafts...10spline 25.3mm minor dia Vs 24 spline 29.2 minor dia. Thats a 15.4% increase in dia and a 33% increase in cross sectional area....

I am no way saying I think a rover with 10 splines better than a sals (in stock forms)

What I have been trying to bring, and I feel you are to, is that there is so much more going on than what we have breifly glossed over.

Now I can NOT confirm the info regarding 10 spliners being as strong or stronger in a one off twist to break machine.....

**Red90** · 12th October 2012, 03:00 AM

Originally Posted by steveG

Has anyone actually broken a standard Defender rear axle? Not talking about stripping splines due to them fretting to the point where they fail, but a physical failure of a good condition axle.

Yep...

Broken Salsbury Axle on 33s

Sals Axle

Disco 1 Rear Axle.

As you can see late model Disco/90/RR shafts are necked down to about the same diameter as 10 spline axles...