Thread: The "New" Defender, ...Your Thoughts?

Originally Posted by strangy

Planetary gearbox would do the trick nicely.
Total unsparing weight compared to live axles would be less and I'd say roughly 1/2 to 2/3 when considering no brake discs and calipers.

No brakes now?

Originally Posted by JDNSW

I suppose that it would be churlish to point out that in June 1947 Rover first looked at the possibility of a four wheel drive - unlike anything they had ever built before, but they still launched the Landrover at the end of April 1948, and were delivering production models before the end of the year.

Now certainly the design of a new Defender will be much more complicated, as are the hoops they need to jump through - but the effort in 1947-8 was done with vastly inferior resources, and in particular, without computers.

Like that design, any new Defender would certainly use many parts from existing models, including the engine, and I have no doubt it will have an Ingenium engine - perhaps the only question will be which one(s).

John

And the world has changed immensely from then John. From two guys bashing stuff together in a shed, to launching to a global market where the design regulations, safety regulations, emmisions regulations of 200 countries have to be taken into consideration, before even thinking about the dyed-in-the-wool Land Rover fans who think they have a right to have an input.

The world was a much more simple place then. Yes, the computer aided design would take away a lot of the trial and error that would have been used back in the late 40s, and speed things up, but ultimately, with limited resources (a design team who will have just finished on the D5), a finite budget, and an audience waiting with baited breath, 4 years is no time.

I used to work for a company in the UK that produced moulded (and painted) exterior parts for Land Rover and other vehicle manufacturers. For a new model, it could easily take 18 months to industrialise one part. From having the moulding tool manufactured, to trialling a part, to finalising and optimising the paint robot parameters, to sign off. A long process.

Originally Posted by sheerluck

And the world has changed immensely from then John. From two guys bashing stuff together in a shed, to launching to a global market where the design regulations, safety regulations, emmisions regulations of 200 countries have to be taken into consideration, before even thinking about the dyed-in-the-wool Land Rover fans who think they have a right to have an input.

The world was a much more simple place then. Yes, the computer aided design would take away a lot of the trial and error that would have been used back in the late 40s, and speed things up, but ultimately, with limited resources (a design team who will have just finished on the D4), a finite budget, and an audience waiting with baited breath, 4 years is no time.

I used to work for a company in the UK that produced moulded (and painted) exterior parts for Land Rover and other vehicle manufacturers. For a new model, it could easily take 18 months to industrialise one part. From having the moulding tool manufactured, to trialling a part, to finalising and optimising the paint robot parameters, to sign off. A long process.

Yes, the world has changed immensely. And, apart from the points you make (which I mentioned in very abbreviated form) and the resources that are now available that were not even dreamt of seventy years ago, such as computer aided design, tooling and manufacture, there is another factor.

We are no longer talking about a very small, capital limited, conservative, albeit fairly successful car manufacturer, but a medium sized and very successful subsidiary of one of the largest conglomerates in the world, which manufactures, apart from Landrovers, a very wide variety of cars and trucks of all types. Landrover is also probably one of the most profitable motor manufacturers in the world.

No, I do not think that they need to take another four years to produce a replacement that they have admitted to already having been working on for years, but I think I have to agree that it is likely. This is simply because I don't think they have come to a decision what to build. If they had come to a decision, I would expect some sort of credible information to have appeared answering a lot of the questions.

(As an aside, I wonder if there is something in the fact that two of the world's most successful car companies, Ford and Tata, are both family companies? And hence perhaps able to take a longer term view than the rest?)

John

Originally Posted by Dervish

No brakes now?

No,
Why bother if we are going electric with dynamic braking may as well go all the way.

.....and just to put things into perspective for the electric fanciers.....

18....just 18 electric cars were sold in Australia in the last financial year.

btw , there weren't really many Defenders sold either.....so a new gen Defender powered by whatever alternative power system isn't going to raise the figures much either.....especially at the prices LR charge for their vehicles.

Originally Posted by Andrew86

Let's not forget that JLR has invested half a billion GBP in its Ingenium 2L turbo diesel that has only recently started its life. They're going to want to get a decent return on that investment before replacing it with alternative technologies. It makes a lot of sense for it to be at the heart of the next Defender.

I'm sure electric vehicles are on their roadmap, but I think 2020 is too soon for it to be in a volume seller like the Defender is intended to be. I wouldn't be surprised if we see some sort of electric-hybrid technology appearing in the Range Rover fleet in that time frame though.

+1....Agree.
See my post 75 of 23/6!
Pickles.

Originally Posted by ramblingboy42

.....and just to put things into perspective for the electric fanciers.....

18....just 18 electric cars were sold in Australia in the last financial year.

btw , there weren't really many Defenders sold either.....so a new gen Defender powered by whatever alternative power system isn't going to raise the figures much either.....especially at the prices LR charge for their vehicles.

Last financial year is irrelevant. It's the next 10 years that are relevant.

Today's news - "Mercedes-Benz executives predict that the auto industry will change more over the next 10 years than it has in the past 50, and they see the company as well-positioned to capitalize on that change".

MB are voting next week on setting up a standalone EV brand.

Originally Posted by steane

Last financial year is irrelevant. It's the next 10 years that are relevant.

Today's news - "Mercedes-Benz executives predict that the auto industry will change more over the next 10 years than it has in the past 50, and they see the company as well-positioned to capitalize on that change".

MB are voting next week on setting up a standalone EV brand.

Three words. Hybrid diesel electric.