Thread: Defender vs Tojo 70

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

A bloke told me yesterday that his 200 series TDV8 uses 17-18 l/100 kms towing a caravan with an ATM of 2000kg which we might buy.
I didn't have the heart to tell him our Defender might only use 11-12 to do the same job.

Most likely that is at 90-100km/hr too. There’s no escaping the fact that those big engines use a lot of fuel even if they’re not towing. 18+L/100km driving at 110km/hr with aircon on and not towing IME. Many don’t mind the big fuel bills obviously.

Originally Posted by DazzaTD5

*I started working on Land Rovers.
*Up north I worked on Land Cruisers.
*I still work on and prefer Defenders.

I've owned a J75 series Troop Carrier was the second greatest simplest vehicle I ever owned.
I own a Land Rover 110 Perentie and its the greatest simplest vehicle I have ever owned.
I also own a Discovery 2 TD5 and can not see why any normal person would own anything but a Discovery 2.

There is a man who knows his stuff!

Cheers

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

A bloke told me yesterday that his 200 series TDV8 uses 17-18 l/100 kms towing a caravan with an ATM of 2000kg which we might buy.
I didn't have the heart to tell him our Defender might only use 11-12 to do the same job.

Those two vehicles aren’t in the same class,towing with a 200 is a BIG difference than towing with a Defender.

My D4 will use around 16/17 l/100 towing that kind of weight,same class and comfort as LC200.

In fact I think you will find out you Defender will use a bit more than 11 to 12 towing that sort of weight.Many get that sort of fuel usage towing nothing,mainly due to big tyres,weight of accessories,etc.

Originally Posted by scarry

Those two vehicles aren’t in the same class,towing with a 200 is a BIG difference than towing with a Defender.

My D4 will use around 16/17 l/100 towing that kind of weight,same class and comfort as LC200.

In fact I think you will find out you Defender will use a bit more than 11 to 12 towing that sort of weight.Many get that sort of fuel usage towing nothing,mainly due to big tyres,weight of accessories,etc.

It currently uses about 11.5 towing our camper, which is about 500kg lighter than the van we're looking at, so I wouldn't expect it to rise too much.

Originally Posted by scarry

Those two vehicles aren’t in the same class,...

Correct. Defender is much more economical on fuel, more capable off road and has more character being a design classic.

Originally Posted by scarry

...towing with a 200 is a BIG difference than towing with a Defender.

Correct. Towing with a LC200 is easier due to more power, AND LC200's use a lot more fuel than Defenders.

Originally Posted by DiscoMick

It currently uses about 11.5 towing our camper, which is about 500kg lighter than the van we're looking at, so I wouldn't expect it to rise too much.

Not only 500 kg heavier,but I would think a lot more wind resistance as well.

It all adds up to more fuel

I think people buy Toyos because there are lots of them. I have also experienced the outback mechanic that swears he will never touch a Landrover. The shear number of Toyotas means that mechanics are used to seeing them and are comfortable to work on them. Anything different from what they normally see makes them uncomfortable.

Many people also have a bias against LR from the days of series vehicles and the legend lives on. When there were few off road capable vehicles people found series vehicles to be slow under powered and noisy. There were a lot of Holden conversions as the LR engines were costly to overhaul compared to pulling a six cylinder from a wreck and the issue of a few more ponies also made them more attractive.

The Japanese produce plenty of vehicles and they generally do a good job. This is not restricted to 4WDs. They lead the world on outboards, motorbikes, heavy earthwork machinery etc. They generally started with something that was world best practice copied it and then improved on it, and improved and improved. A bit bland at times but people don’t care if it is reliable.

Newer LRs have certainly improved from the days when the Brits thought they were the best and why would anyone need more than 4 cylinders. The intro of the 200/300Tdi was a milestone for LR. But other than in the UK, African colonies and keen aficionados in other parts of the world, LR had cooked its goose as the Japanese produced the quantities of vehicles the off road dependant industries required.

I am one of the aficionados as I like the ride and capability of both my 300Tdi Defender and Td5 D2a. I will hold onto both for as long as I can, although I suspect that the pressure will be on here to ban diesels like in some European cities. When they get electric delivery trucks to service city customers, the days of diesels will numbered in cities.

Originally Posted by slug_burner

I think people buy Toyos because there are lots of them. I have also experienced the outback mechanic that swears he will never touch a Landrover. The shear number of Toyotas means that mechanics are used to seeing them and are comfortable to work on them. Anything different from what they normally see makes them uncomfortable.

Many people also have a bias against LR from the days of series vehicles and the legend lives on. When there were few off road capable vehicles people found series vehicles to be slow under powered and noisy. There were a lot of Holden conversions as the LR engines were costly to overhaul compared to pulling a six cylinder from a wreck and the issue of a few more ponies also made them more attractive.

The Japanese produce plenty of vehicles and they generally do a good job. This is not restricted to 4WDs. They lead the world on outboards, motorbikes, heavy earthwork machinery etc. They generally started with something that was world best practice copied it and then improved on it, and improved and improved. A bit bland at times but people don’t care if it is reliable.

Newer LRs have certainly improved from the days when the Brits thought they were the best and why would anyone need more than 4 cylinders. The intro of the 200/300Tdi was a milestone for LR. But other than in the UK, African colonies and keen aficionados in other parts of the world, LR had cooked its goose as the Japanese produced the quantities of vehicles the off road dependant industries required.

I am one of the aficionados as I like the ride and capability of both my 300Tdi Defender and Td5 D2a. I will hold onto both for as long as I can, although I suspect that the pressure will be on here to ban diesels like in some European cities. When they get electric delivery trucks to service city customers, the days of diesels will numbered in cities.

Excellent post Slugburner. Absolutely true. The bias against Land Rover has been very difficult to overcome, particularly as Land Rover effectively gave up on the average punter, tradie, cocky, adventurer in favour of the wealthy urbanista. ...Not a good thing in a country that values pragmatic machinery over bling.

If I was concerned by any of that I would definitely drive a Toyota. But in my experience Defenders are better than Land Cruisers. So I drive a Defender. It's as simple as that, which is why I am one of the aficionados too.

I think you're correct re diesel and the race to electric vehicles - it's really hotting up... I'd be willing to bet this has been a big factor in the delayed release of a new Defender.

All Land Rover vehicles hybrid / EV by 2020.... But the traditional buyer base of a working vehicle such as a Defender will be difficult to win over in the short term without a diesel. Hmmm