Reply With QuoteGreat write up. Would be interested to see some pictures of what you found as you pulled it apart.
I decided to go down the import a new drive shaft from the U.S. from BPUtah. Yet to pull the old one out.
ChatterBox
So after looking at most of the options, I decided to rebuild the standard shaft myself.
For the Uni bearings, I'm not convinced I have the best option but I thought for the price, I dont have much to loose. Well that's what I thought. I was quoted $17 ea but when I went to pick them up, I was hit with $60 freight for 3. Not having much knowledge of what was inside the Doubel Cardan joint at this time, I didn't want to burn my bridge with the drive shaft place as I didn't know anyone else that could replace the cardan bearing, should I need it done as well.
So had they only been $17 ea, If they don't last. I wouldn't have lost too much.
Further on this. It was $17 for the K5-L4R beaings and about $77 for the K5-A757. The bearing place up here tried to tell me they were the same bearing but just different suppliers. Then I said the K5-A757 were listed as heavy duty but they still told me they were the same thing. Then I said but they are listed as having a thrust pad. Then they said "oh yeh, that's the only difference and it's not worth it" but they had only just told me there was no difference a few words prior. This didn't do much for my confidence in them.
I had watched a few YouTube vids that I could knock out the Uni bearings with a hammer but I decided I could use my ball joint press which I already have.
I marked each peice of the shaft so I can assemble it back the same way. I presume it's balanced so I didn't want to reassemple it out of sync.
I just give the bearing caps a tap using a hammer and a socked extension to move them away from the circlips and then tapped a punch around the circlip to loosen it. The circlips came out very easily then I just pressed the bearings all the way, one way, removed the cap protuding from the outside, pressed it back the other and did the same. The bearing then was free take out.
While only 2 Uni bearings on one end of the Cardan joint had lost their needle bearings, the other ones must have been very close because they were just full of rust powder.
For new player to Cardan joints (like me). Once the uni bearings come out of the ends of the Cardan joint. The 2 ends are free to move away. The shaft side has a pin that locates into a ball in the flange end. When the pin moves out of the ball, all the needle bearings fall out. I thought I was just going to check if the ball joint needed replacing butonce all the needle bearings fell out on the ground, I thought it just best to replace. I dont really know if it would be possible to replace the uni bearings without pulling the pin from the ball.
So then I thought I would need to have the drive shaft place replace the ball but on closer inspection, it's not really that difficult.
I bought some internal pullers for $55 which was still cheaper than paying the drive shaft place $100 to do the work and I learn something.
Now the ball didn't want to come out easy. It has an recessed part that the needle bearings roll in. This makes the ends of the ball a little weaker. So in attempting to pull it out, I managed to break the end out of the ball. A quick touch up of the ball with the grinder to take off the recessed part and it popped out. Then I found the socked was actually 2 seperate pieces. So on to the socket with the pullers and out it came as well.
I have ordered the new ball at $120 and it should be in Wednesday. I ordered it from CBC, not wanting to go back to the drive shaft place after being stung shipping.
So far. I can say it might be slightly fiddly but not difficult at all. If you have internal pullers, you can rebuild the shaft for less than $200. That means I can rebuild it 3 times and it still wont cost as much as some of the improved shafts.
I know these improved shafts will handle more angle and are much stronger but I haven't read yet of anyone breaking a standard shaft. I'm not saying it's never happened but it's not common enough for me to stumble across reading about a broken shaft. Plenty seem to wear out but looking at the single uni bearing on the opposite end of the shaft, it showed no signs (maybe a little if I looked hard) of wear. I'm putting that down to it being geasable. I'll keep all the Uni bearings greased every 5000km in the furture and I doubt I'll have too much trouble.
Just another option for those that have a limp shaft.
I'll post some updates as I put it back together. I know the new ball comes with a cardboard tube to keen the bearings in place until the pin is inserted and I'm guessing that;s going to be tricky.
Happy Days.
ChatterBox
SubscriberGreat write up. Would be interested to see some pictures of what you found as you pulled it apart.
I decided to go down the import a new drive shaft from the U.S. from BPUtah. Yet to pull the old one out.
AT REST$120 for the centre Ball,Originally Posted by joel0407
you should ask us Forum Vendors, we sell the Genuine Hardy spicer balls for much less than that to forum members. $75! I could have done one for you, and $10.50 express post to Darwin
Re difficulty of getting them out, I did one that was stubborn and tapped the inner ball base with a Welder to make it Hot and as it contracted it popped out easy.
Regards,
Mario
Master
When I did mine the only 2 bits I had issue with were getting the cup out of the socket, I ended up getting a dremel in there to relieve it and then it came out. As you found there isn't a lot of lip to grip on to.
The other things was reassembling the cardan joint, from memory it's awkward and I kind of remember having to assemble both sides at the same time and needing 4 hands.
Keeping the needles in the centre bearing in place was a challenge..
The other great thing about doing this is you can put greasable UJs in, just try to remember to put the nipples opposite each other to provide balance.
Wizard
Good old Darwin freight,got a quote for some discs and pads off a well known national company they wanted to charge freight,If you order online off the same place free delivery to your door,work that out.
Master
SubscriberThis maybe more of a problem in the tropics. I'm in Cairns and I'm not sure if this has come up before, but a few years ago I had a cardan joint fail. I rebuilt it from a kit I got from ebay for $180.
But what I noticed when I was under there was that the drivers A/C condensate drain was directly above the cardan joint and dripping directly onto it. It was also right next to the Cat so it was getting hot then wet. Not a good thing but it explained the rusty dry bearings.
I extended the drain line down to the chassis rail and haven't had a problem since and it still looks in good shape. Maybe worth considering.
AT RESTAus post Express satchel from Melbourne to Darwin is $14.60, 2 Days , it is (the same no matter where it comes from) $60 is a rip off, Unless you you asked for a overnighter then it might be that price you were charged
Regards,
Mario
ChatterBox
Yes, I knew very well I was being ripped off but I didn't really know how the Cardan joint went together and I thought I might need them.
The only YouTube vid I could find was for a Jeep Shaft.
Near every thread I have read on here is about replacing the shaft with a Tom Woods or equivalent or getting someone else to rebuild it for you. I guess the main reason for my post is to let everyone know, it's not really that hard. If you have a just a little bit of nous well have a go. It works out pretty cheap even if I have to rebuild it 3 times, it will still be cheaper than a replacement.
Happy Days.
ChatterBox
Ok. So here are some pictures.
I'm pretty paranoid about a few things on the Disco. I think it's caused by too much time on here, only reading about things that go wrong. As much as I want a Manual gear box, I could really afford it if the drive shaft was to rip a hole in the Auto. So when I heard a little squeak, I got straight underneath and this is what I found:
One bearing had all the needle rollers gone and the opposite bearing had just a few missing. I guess the movement was about 5mm. It was easily noticeable to wiggle it with my hand.
So I took it straight out and just locked the centre diff. I've probably done about 200km around town like this. Just driving around sorting the above story.
I should have done a video of the removal but i didn't. I should have taken more photos too but I didn't. The bearings came through really easy. You could just use a bench vice if that's all you have. Just use a large socket on one side for the bearing cap to slide into and a small socket to push the other side in.
This is what came out: (the single end was still greasy so it went straight to the bin) This is he Cardan joint end:
As I said previously, the socket is in 2 pieces and I had to grind the side off the ball because it broke away when I was trying to pull it.
I gave all the parts a good scrub and covered the bearing surfaces:
And this is where I am at now:
Fossicker
Good on you for rebuilding it! I just did mine, and as others have observed it pays to have four hands! I bought the entire kit (3 greasable GKN UJs and centering bearing) from JG's 4x4 in the UK and it cost about $120 nzd including shipping, and an afternoons work. One of my universal joints was so badly worn it's a miracle it didn't explode.
Check out the photo... All that with no symptoms. I caught it on a visual inspection.
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