this would make me very nervous, record gun sales in US

Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.
A Little Gun History -

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.

China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.

Switzerland issues every household a gun! Switzerland's government trains every adult and issues each a rifle. Switzerland has the lowest gun related crime rate of any civilized country in the world! It's a no brainer! Don't let our government waste millions of our tax dollars in an effort to make all law abiding citizens an easy target....

Gun Control laws adversly affect only the law-abiding citizens.

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Originally Posted by 460cixy

I can't be leave there's so many antis here and some very opinionated ppl here still won't stop me from enjoying my sport no matter how narrow minded some ppl may be

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No ones saying or telling you to stop enjoying shooting, the anti's are saying we don't need the concealed or open carry handgun laws of the US.

Almost to a person, every 'anti' as you call them here are shooters !

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Originally Posted by Mick-Kelly

Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.

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Very true

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Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.

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Obviously the reasons are far more complex and many of those people would not have had guns anyway. And even if they did, a company of the Waffen SS will be more effective than a shhopkeeper with a K98.

But yes the parralel is not conincidental !

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Gun Control laws adversly affect only the law-abiding citizens.

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Absolutely correct.

Aparently there are laws against murder too, but the criminals don't seem to follow them either ! How curious ! Obviously we need to make murder "double illegal"

Hmmmm? whats going on in this thread? :angel:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mick-Kelly

Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.
A Little Gun History -

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.

China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.

Switzerland issues every household a gun! Switzerland's government trains every adult and issues each a rifle. Switzerland has the lowest gun related crime rate of any civilized country in the world! It's a no brainer! Don't let our government waste millions of our tax dollars in an effort to make all law abiding citizens an easy target....

Gun Control laws adversly affect only the law-abiding citizens.

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In the 1920's Australia initiated handgun regulation.

How many Aussies have been rounded up since and systematically murdered by their Government as a consequence ?

How many in the UK ? Canada ? or any other stable democracy that has handgun regulation ?

Those numbers you've quoted mean nothing, sorry.

At the end of the day, this is Australia, not Soviet Russia, not Amin's Uganda and certainly not the US.

Who the hell is going to invade/take up arms against the population here ?

Who are you scared of ?


Do I think some of our compliance laws are stupid ?

Yep.

Do I want hand gun laws relaxed ?

No.

You only have to see how people drive with their 2.5 tonne lethal wheeled weapons to realise you don't want Bruce and Kath average handling a bloody handgun.



Americans lost more personal freedom under the Bush administration than under any other admin in recent history, including wartime, all under the pretext of 'National Security'.

They are being spied on, monitored and have less redress under the law, particularly against their own government than at any other point in their history, but they can still shoot each other 'legally' in record numbers by God !

Who's being hoodwinked ?

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Originally Posted by rick130

Who the hell is going to invade/take up arms against the population here ?

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Well that's open to debate, and while unlikely at the moment is certainly possible in future. Why deny people the opportunity of resistance to such an possibility.

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Do I want hand gun laws relaxed ?

No.

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What handgun lawas are you referring to? I have to do 6 competitions a year to maintain my right to own a firearm. Am I less trustworthy if I only was to do 5? It's a pointless law that needs to be changed and will be of no harm to society AT ALL.

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You only have to see how people drive with their 2.5 tonne lethal wheeled weapons to realise you don't want Bruce and Kath average handling a bloody handgun.

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Umm, most shooters ARE Bruce and Kath average mate. We are not special in any respect other than being law abiding citizens and having undergone background and criminal checks (which the bulk of the population do not).

What a person's driving ability has to do with anyone's firearm safety is beyond me.

Quote:

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Americans lost more personal freedom under the Bush administration than under any other admin in recent history, including wartime, all under the pretext of 'National Security'.

They are being spied on, monitored and have less redress under the law, particularly against their own government than at any other point in their history, but they can still shoot each other 'legally' in record numbers by God !

Who's being hoodwinked ?

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Well....

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Originally Posted by The second amendment

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed

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The reasoning behind the amendment are not in the amendment itself, however it is discussed in detail in many contemporary sources.

One of the considerations was the reasoning that an armed populace would deter an authoritarian regime imposing itself upon an unwilling people.

By your reasoning the American public needs guns now more than ever !

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Originally Posted by THE BOOGER

I heard from a friend that knows a guy that he heard it was masked australian soldiers the same ones who were involved with the coup in fiji;)

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You know him too? (except he's my second cousin's mate, that knows the guy who heard.) :o

Nothing better than true known facts to dispel urban myths! ;)

a good quote for you

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Originally Posted by VladTepes

Well that's open to debate, and while unlikely at the moment is certainly possible in future. Why deny people the opportunity of resistance to such an possibility.

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Who ? and resistance against an armed, professional army ? Really ?

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What handgun lawas are you referring to? I have to do 6 competitions a year to maintain my right to own a firearm. Am I less trustworthy if I only was to do 5? It's a pointless law that needs to be changed and will be of no harm to society AT ALL.

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I actually agree with you there, and part of the reason why I've never obtained a handgun licence, it's too bloody onerous to make a 200km round trip for a shoot IMO, but allowing a handgun for self defence at home, just incase, because someone feels a little threatened as has been suggested on this thread is just silly.

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Umm, most shooters ARE Bruce and Kath average mate. We are not special in any respect other than being law abiding citizens and having undergone background and criminal checks (which the bulk of the population do not).

What a person's driving ability has to do with anyone's firearm safety is beyond me.

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How people act and react in daily life has everything to do with it.
So many people don't act responsibly already and do plain dumb things when driving cars, people walking out in front of cars, etc, why would it be any different if it was open slather with handguns ?

At the moment if someone really wants to go shooting, with the legislative hoops they have to jump through they are more than likely going to be a little more responsible in their attitude and handling of same too.
Having said that there were blokes I knew who were licensed shooters I would never go away with on a shooting weekend, and some blokes I did go away with did some stupid, stupid things too....

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Well....



The reasoning behind the amendment are not in the amendment itself, however it is discussed in detail in many contemporary sources.

One of the considerations was the reasoning that an armed populace would deter an authoritarian regime imposing itself upon an unwilling people.

By your reasoning the American public needs guns now more than ever !

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Hahahaha, nice try.

How losing so many rights yet being able to keep a firearm is freedom I'm really not sure.




Here in Oz we still have so many longarms and can still go hunting/target shooting whenever we want.

The stats I've seen suggest more legal firearms in circulation now than before Mr Howard's infamous 'buyback'. (and yes, I was affected by that too, a stupid waste of time and money)

There is so much disinformation from both sides of the debate it gets silly
People from the US I talk to are genuinely surprised we go shooting.
"Didn't you have all your guns taken away...." is a common response.
When they hear how often we actually go out hunting and shooting they are genuinely gobsmacked.
All because the pro-gun lobby in the US (read NRA) keeps spreading disinformation about the rest of the world.

I've learnt to take arguments from both pro and anti-gun control groups with a bucket load of salt.

No one is going to invade us,no one is going to exterminate us and no one is going to put us in camps. Pat