RIP Defender....

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Originally Posted by goingbush

Thanks Tombie, I dislike Harleys but the penny just dropped, Now I get why Harley riders love their bikes, exactly same as we love our Defenders.

If your a Harley Rider , why don't you just move with the times (and get a Vstrom ), yah right

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Well guess what!

Air cooled V-twins are being phased out by emissions regs... Hence the toe in the water V-Rod... Considered by many traditionalists as "not a real HD" - Sound familiar?!!!

Me, I wanted power, reliability and value.
A Japanese bike provided all that and more...
In fact we got 2 :)

HD riders have them because of image.
The HD image is a modern success story in marketing. They are brilliant, selling the entire package which is all S&G and no real substance.

The Defender was about no frills... Not image. Then it got A/C, leather, CD, MP3... Now it's image that sells ;)

Random thought #1
A spanner is a tool
A timing light is a tool (and often electronic)
A code reader/diagnostic unit is a tool

Not a lot in it really!

Random thought #2
And those yarping on about "crumbly plastic" the Disco plastic is going fine 13 yrs on.

Yet younger Defenders are suffering bulkhead corrosion, capping rusting, rusty cross members etc.

Composites are here to stay, they are often very resilient and corrosion resistant/proof.

Random thought #3
Someone buys a Defender (even one of those Puma things) and all the Defender drivers go "good on ya".

They shove a lift, bar work, lockers, and other bits and ****s on them spending anything up to $70k on their toy.

No one slays them for it, even though they have weaker diffs, and same axles they've had for 20 yrs.

Yet when someone spends the same on a D4 and adds a bar up front (locker etc are avail for that price) and LLAMS they're ridiculed?

Well I say... **** you!

I work bloody hard to have my shiny new Luxo toy. It spends more time doing real work than many Defenders ever will and has never had anything but servicing done.

I have the diagnostic tool (I'm lucky I have more than one vehicle to use it on - A TD5 D2, A D3 (Dads) and the D4.)
It's just that - a tool - it's in a box with the other basic hand tools I carry when travelling.

I also have a transmission jack and a hoist on the way - because it makes my life easier... I got the jack because I can't drop a TC and Auto easily on my own without it!

I can tune and work on a TD5/Bosch V8 as easy as I could my old 351 Ford (although it was easier to reach stuff at times) it was just a matter of wanting to learn.

Justin Cooper can handle a D4 and not have a nervous break down....

Most people I know wouldn't / couldn't fix a SIII if they wanted too...
Plenty of money is made recovering vehicles with "easy fix" faults...

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Originally Posted by Tombie

The Defender was about no frills... Not image. Then it got A/C, leather, CD, MP3... Now it's image that sells ;)

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lol.. men will be wearing makeup next and you'll tell us to move with the times. I don't doubt it will happen, those marketing folk tap into new markets by tapping into your mind.

"Dude you are looking messed up today, here try my bulldog face protector - its a manly foundation that will keep you looking good and protect your skin from harmful exhaust smoke and EV radiation using the latest in molecular protophaser technology... you will die without it"

sold yet?

No... But I do wear sun protection.

Nowhere near as much as I should and I'm far more complacent with my own "Sun Smarts" than I was with my kids...

And I'm far better off than my Skin Cancer and melanoma riddled/scarred older mates with bits burnt and hacked off everywhere.

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Originally Posted by Tombie

No... But I do wear sun protection.

Nowhere near as much as I should and I'm far more complacent with my own "Sun Smarts" than I was with my kids...

And I'm far better off than my Skin Cancer and melanoma riddled/scarred older mates with bits burnt and hacked off everywhere.

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good to hear Tombie.. slip slap slop :D ... you're an up to date guy so I bet your sunscreen is free of zinc oxide too.

Land Rover. (Let's not split hairs)
SI, SII, SIII, County, Defender.

Same basic design/shape from day dot.

The occupant area of a Defender is like the "Anti-Tardis"; looks huge outside but deceptively small inside. (This does not reflect comfort in my example - I found my Defender comfy to drive)


The new version will like its competitors need to have:

DSC - it's mandatory in many markets now; including Victoria.
ABS
SRS
Crumple zones
To tap commercial market needs to be ANCAP 5
More leg room
More shoulder room
Back seats that aren't designed for an anorexic dwarf
Emissions complaint engine - this means electronic controls
Power! Market want it...
Security - also mandated now
Pedestrian compliant frontal area

There is no way the current version can be adapted to meet this!

And this pertains to the topic at hand how?
But yes, I even have the MSDS if you like.

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Originally Posted by Tombie

There is no way the current version can be adapted to meet this!

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No but it is possible for a new one to meet those requirements and still honor the previous models. Mercedes seem to be able to manage it with their G-Class.

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Originally Posted by manic

No but it is possible for a new one to meet those requirements and still honor the previous models. Mercedes seem to be able to manage it with their G-Class.

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For $170k :) full of electronics.
Better body shape to work with from the get go. Not modular.

Honour the past? Like the successful FJ Cruiser :lol:

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Originally Posted by Tombie

For $170k :) full of electronics.
Better body shape to work with from the get go. Not modular.

Honour the past? Like the successful FJ Cruiser :lol:

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Forget the g-wagen price.. there are variants... the body shape is similar... its still made for military... still as a utility spec... it has been changed over the years... it does not appear to be going anywhere in 2015... it holds some integrity.

The FJ Cruiser is the example of how it could go wrong.

I want the new defender to be advanced. It should have electronics but it would be nice to see integrated diagnostic tools, self diagnostics and on board repair guides, fall back systems, intelligent limp modes that allow you to void your warranty to proceed at all costs. E-diffs front and back. Waterproofed electronics, practically submersible, hose out interior --> New age tough!