For a given definition of commonality.Quote:
Originally Posted by garrycol
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For a given definition of commonality.Quote:
Originally Posted by garrycol
Face it, folks. Holden is now just a badge. At least Ford had the decency to retire the Falcon name. Holden gives us this hyperbole:
Explore the All-New Holden Commodore Range. Discover the Next Generation Of Our Most Iconic Car.
Holden Commodore 2018 Range | Holden Australia
They have to be joking. And a sick joke at that
Yes the new Commodore is no longer even a GM product - is a peugeot product with the takeover of Opel last year. Yes it was designed and built as a GM product but at the time it went on sale no ownership links remain with GM.
Yes which makes all the other so called excuses total bull****, Toyota could make it work but the other two couldnt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homestar
Holden was just a blatant theft from Australian tax payers (personal opinion) and produced nothing but unreliable ****box cars. The latest Holden 4x4 is slapped together in Mexico.
And as already mentioned, this is what happens when you have contempt for customers and Australians. Holden GM dont let the door slap you in the arse on the way out.
And prob not long till that badge goes [emoji15] too.Quote:
Originally Posted by johntins
I hear you, I find it a joke with the way it is being advertised.
Not going to get into an argument over this but the same team worked on both chassis. It was co-developed and Ford led as the overall owners with both variants branching off a common still-born project. I sat opposite one of the senior members of that team for the last few years. LR were essentially forced to use it (platform sharing) and had to find other ways to acheive their own internal performance criterea. Like developing a unitary body to sit ontop of it and stiffen it. Mind you, they also 'tweaked' it as much as they could and a casual visual inspection does not really highlight the inherent similarities from an architecture perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by garrycol
History tells us that the Discovery 3/4 is a gem that was the best modern 4WD anywhere and spun off other successful variants and lived well beyond it's projected lifetime... where the Explorer was just another in the crowd and short-lived. Shows what you can do even when dealt a poor hand, with the other tied behind your back. Kudos to LR. What a legacy they created and how they moved the benchmark.
It's a bugger, getting old. I remember when Ford vs Holden actually meant something here. I once had a girlfriend who had an L34 Torana. Her qualities needed to be special, because I was a Ford man. Once, at Calder, I was amongst a group who pushed Moffat's incredible Mustang out of it's little pit tent ( have a look at the pits these days, and remember Moffat, Brock etc are legends to these silhouette racers. They have no idea ) because he had no reverse. Those guys were heroes. Moff, Beechey, Jane, Geogheon ( all of them ) Bond, Brock. There has been nothing since. The racing has become homogonised. So have the cars.Quote:
Originally Posted by pauloarg
I have never watched the so called SuperCars. Why would I? Same with F1. What you see now is tripe. If you don't believe me, look at this:
https://youtu.be/3GOEorrE4mY
https://youtu.be/1hUWuR2Dj78
There is no one in the list atm who compares. Not even close. With the rules these days we will never find out.
You cannot compare apples with lemons, I know.
This bloke, however, might have given him a shake as the greatest ever of the modern era:
https://youtu.be/QEhPHPvXfLY
There isn't a driver in the paddock that can hold a candle to either of them, and in the current climate there never will be. That is why I no longer care about motor racing. It just isn't, anymore. OH&S gets in the way, always.
I linked to F1 because the message is the same, and the vids are MUCH easier to find. The principle is identical.
Holden vs Ford was born in racing. I know. I was there and I watched. At Calder, at Sandown, at Warwick Farm, and especially at Bathurst. Unless you are over 50 you have NFI.
Tombie talks of V8s. Sure. He's right. Sort of. What WE wanted was the V8 that was in the car that MofBrockBond had. It was the same thing as CountDown, where we could play the songs that were the top in the UK, only we couldn't play them if the original artists were involved ( look it up ). What the Australian Touring Car series gave us was local racing that was every bit as good as what you would have seen anywhere for the class. The difference with the racing was, we did it better than them. Moffat had a fair bit to do with that. He worked tirelessly to attract sponsorship. It's a pity that it took a Canadian to put us on the map, but Moff has always been a 'polarising' figure.
The end of car production in Australia - what went wrong | Autocar
There's a bit of "Hoo Ha" developing in this thread.
The above is an article which sums up the situation pretty well I think. Someone made a comment about the Camry, you will note that over the last 20 yrs, 7 out of 10 Camrys were EXPORTED, something that Ford & Holden could not do,....as I've said before,...and as I've also said, were NOTHING to do with any Aussie decision making. If we could've got our exports going, Ford & Holden Aus would be in amuch different situation now. Toyota had exported 1.3M cars by the time the factory closed.
Anyway, I ain't gonna ramble on, just read the link, I reckon it's a good, and fairly accurate read.
Pickles.
Yes, Toyota showed that cars could be made here mainly for export, but Ford and GM failed.
When I first arrived in Australia, it was 2012
Back then the economists were constantly warning everybody and the government about double speed economy
This is what we called Dutch disease.
It essentially means if one country export a lot of raw materials,(Aussie export raw materials to China), and thus a sudden inflow of foreign currencies, the currency (Aussie dollar) will appreciate to such a degree that other department of the economy will start to shrink.becuase it is impossible for them to compete on a global market.
This happen to Holland before when they export the natural gas just like what Australia export the iron ore and other stuffs to China.
This is very very basic and very plain simple. First year college student will know this.
Yet our government is jerking itself all day everyday. And now Australia is the banana republic among the OECD countries.
In my opinion, there is no pride in exporting raw materials. You dig stuffs up and sell them, and leave nothing for next generation. When the Majority of the export is raw materials, you are very passive you don't have any market power.
This is because raw material can be easily substituted. nobody cares if the iron is from Australia or India or Canada, but every human wants a BMW or Land Rover.
Aussie farmers sell wool to China and guess what, the Chinese decide the price. Because so many country can produce raw wool But few turn wool into sweaters.
This is one side. Of course, the background of history, that Australia has a severe dose of Dutch disease.
The other side is, I was watching Holden media conference. The CEO said, for one dollar government subsidies us, we will produce 4 dollars of social benefits to our workers.
I watch it and I was in shock and disbelief.
I though this could only happen to a rotten Communist country where the state owned company is bleeding everybody dry.
I am glad the government stop the subsidy. I never had a bond with Holden so for me, it is just an American company robbing my tax dollar.