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Thread: Petrol and diesel mix

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gruntfuttock View Post
    It is my belief that power kero is basically avgas BEFORE they add the mixture to make it more explosive. Donít take this as gospel, but itís just what I was told by an old bloke
    The old bloke was either pulling your leg, or full of brown stuff!

    This thread is about diesel and petrol, but somehow kerosene has leaked into it.

    For kerosene look here: Kerosene - Wikipedia

    For tractors look here: Tractor vaporising oil - Wikipedia

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by gruntfuttock View Post
    It is my belief that power kero is basically avgas BEFORE they add the mixture to make it more explosive. Donít take this as gospel, but itís just what I was told by an old bloke
    I do not think so. Power kerosine was referred to in the UK as Tractor Vaporising Oil, and it has a wikipedia entry - says the octane was 55-70.

    This does not necessarily transfer to Australian conditions though. UK crude oil has mostly come from the Middle East, and is high in aromatics, where Australian crude imports have historically come from the Far East and North America, and would have been mostly paraffinic. The final composition of any product is constrained by its crude source.

    Lighting kerosine has always been legally constrained to have a maximum flash point, which means lighter fractions must be removed, and market constrained to have not too much heavies, as these would make the flame smoky, and low sulphur, as this stinks. But octane rating was never even a consideration.

    Power kerosine in Australia would have been basically the same fraction as lighting kerosine, but with less restriction on heavies, and with enough octane enhancers (probably branched hydrocarbons or aromatics) added as needed to raise the octane to about the figures quoted for TVO. Lighter fractions would not have been added, as they would have enabled the Power Kerosine to start from cold in many cars - and the idea was to restrict its use to tractors, which were set up with two tanks.

    Worth noting that the first plane I owned (with a Gipsy major engine) was placarded for 70 octane.

    Another note on octane - About 1916 the compression ratio of the Ford T engine was reduced (from about 5.0 to 3.98) as changes in oil sources reduced the average octane rating of petrol in the USA. Not that they knew about octane rating at the time - it was only just being explored by Harry Ricardo in England at the time, and while possible, it is unlikely that Ford would have heard of the work that early. When the US entered WW1 in 1917, one of the first things they did for the war effort was to supply tankerloads of petrol. Which, being lower octane wreaked havoc with Allied aeroplane engines in particular.

    The British got their own back in WW2 when Middle East sourced fuel, high in aromatics, dissolved the self sealing lining of fuel tanks in US aircraft.
    John

    JDNSW
    1986 110 County 3.9 diesel
    1970 2a 109 2.25 petrol

  3. #13
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    assuming its all very well mixed...

    it wont make much difference to the initial vapour point of the fuel as the petrol will still fraction out at low temps and i suspect the flashpoint will remain the same for similar reasons.

    it will very slightly raise the octane rating as the ignition temp will be slightly higher when the mix is blended out of the carby through the venturies as its not naturally evaporating but being forced to atomize via the airflow. this will change as the engine temp increases and the fuel/air mix has the chance to vaporise naturally in the inlet manifold
    It will provide more lubricity and a slight increase in fuel density, probably not enough to make the engine run with more power unless you retune the carby to suit the increased in fuel density.

    it will carbon the plugs as the diesel will not burn cleanly when the engine is cold or if the percentage is too high.
    Dave

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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleHo View Post
    G'day

    I have a friend that has his grandfathers 1923 Chevrolet buckboard ute,it has a compression ratio of 4.5:1 and we dilute ULP91 at a rate of 1 gallon(4.5Ltrs) of Kerosine to 8gallons of ULP91.

    Hope that helps

    cheers
    Back in the 80's my dad use to do something similar with standard petrol and kero for his 1924 Dodge4, again a low compression big capacity 4.
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  5. #15
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    Oct 2017
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    I remember in the early eighties being given the advice after a rebuild to a little diesel to the fuel to help with running in, so thatís what i did. No problems at the time.

    Vehicle was a single cylinder Honda 175

    with what I know now Iím pretty sure it wasnít the right thing to do, but it didnít seem to have any bad side effects.

  6. #16
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    Dec 2017
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    Mornington Vic
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    I have had and restored Fordson tractors. An "N" two "F"'s and 3 E27N's
    All are petrol kero. Petrol to start and kero for running. The 1949 E27N' or Majors loved a mix of 98ron and avgas say about 10-15% they ran cooler and gave that old fashioned power Kerosene smell. Could be fussy to start on the mix, but a quirt of ether fixes that.
    I too was once told by the old guy to run in with a little diesel in petrol. Have done it a couple of times. No complaints and engines as far as I know, still running.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saulman1010 View Post
    I have had and restored Fordson tractors. An "N" two "F"'s and 3 E27N's
    All are petrol kero. Petrol to start and kero for running. The 1949 E27N' or Majors loved a mix of 98ron and avgas say about 10-15% they ran cooler and gave that old fashioned power Kerosene smell. Could be fussy to start on the mix, but a quirt of ether fixes that.
    I too was once told by the old guy to run in with a little diesel in petrol. Have done it a couple of times. No complaints and engines as far as I know, still running.
    Katy and lee.

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