Rodent baits and their effect on native fauna

**Tote** · 24th June 2021, 08:50 PM

It's been a tough year with mice and rats, we've done two lots of baiting in town using TomKat type baits and have had a scare when small white dog ate a baited mouse a couple of weeks ago. Luckily he survived without any side effects.
On the farm we put out baits (screwed to shed timbers) and they were all gone in a week, we rebaited a couple of weeks later and they have only been nibbled a bit which is the usual state they are in for most of the year.
We did find a freshly dead rat outside the shearing shed the other week and thought no more of it and it was gone a couple of days later and we assumed a fox ate it, in which case then secondary poisoning was not an issue but I wonder what the impact is on native wildlife, particularly birds of prey.
We are lucky to have a few wedge tail eagles around the farm (I put my drone up a few weeks ago and very quickly had company of the wedge tail kind making me withdraw) but aside from the odd rat that didn't make it under cover to die we're not large scale baiters.
With the current plague further west does anyone have any experience of the effects of crop baiting on the bird life?

Random gratuitous drone footage here Mayfield 5 - Flyover western side - YouTube

Regards,
Tote

**V8Ian** · 24th June 2021, 09:04 PM

I read, the other day, that the Fed's denied NSW's request to approve a certain type of poison* to combat the current mouse plague.

* I don't recall the scientific name, but it's a poison that blocks the production of vitamin K resulting in death by internal bleeding.
Ratsac is the domestic version, which shares its main component with a blood thinning medication.

I think I read it on the digital ABC news site, if you want to search.

**Tote** · 24th June 2021, 09:15 PM

Ratsack is based on warfarin which is an older generation poison, it relies on rodents having multiple feeds. Newer poisons like TomKat are more effective because they only require one feed to kill but the undigested poison is an issue with secondary poisoning. I don't know much about the zinc phosphide baits that they are using on crops to kill he mice though as we don't need to use them

Regards,
Tote

**Eevo** · 24th June 2021, 09:30 PM

i know very little about mouse/rat plagues

whats the solution? mass baiting on a statewide scale?

**V8Ian** · 24th June 2021, 09:42 PM

Originally Posted by Tote

Ratsack is based on warfarin which is an older generation poison, it relies on rodents having multiple feeds. Newer poisons like TomKat are more effective because they only require one feed to kill but the undigested poison is an issue with secondary poisoning. I don't know much about the zinc phosphide baits that they are using on crops to kill he mice though as we don't need to use them

Regards,
Tote

I may be confusing my poisons. I thought (assumed) that all Ratsack products used the same active ingredient (Warfarin). Our supermarkets are currently short of mousetrap and poisons. The last baits I purchased (square tablets), state that it kills mice and rats with a single feed, so possibly a different ingredient to the previous (pellets) I obtained.

**Slunnie** · 24th June 2021, 09:49 PM

Originally Posted by V8Ian

I read, the other day, that the Fed's denied NSW's request to approve a certain type of poison* to combat the current mouse plague.

* I don't recall the scientific name, but it's a poison that blocks the production of vitamin K resulting in death by internal bleeding.
Ratsac is the domestic version, which shares its main component with a blood thinning medication.

I think I read it on the digital ABC news site, if you want to search.

Yes, my dog is great at sniffing out and eating mouse bait. Needless to say I now use traps. I was using Tomcat which has Bromadiolone that blocks Vitamin K which prevents blood clotting.

The antidote to that mouse poison is vitamin K tablets for a month.

**V8Ian** · 24th June 2021, 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by Slunnie

Yes, my dog is great at sniffing out and eating mouse bait. Needless to say I now use traps. I was using Tomcat which has Bromadiolone that blocks Vitamin K which prevents blood clotting.

The antidote to that mouse poison is vitamin K tablets for a month.

Or generous portions of broccoli or other dark green veggies. That also plays havoc with INRs when prescribed warfarin.

**Slunnie** · 24th June 2021, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by V8Ian

Or generous portions of broccoli or other dark green veggies. That also plays havoc with INRs when prescribed warfarin.

Surprisingly, she will eat Broccoli too!

I just had a look, Ratsack and Talon have Bromadiolone also, so it is Vit K for them also as an antidote.

**V8Ian** · 24th June 2021, 09:59 PM

Are Bromadiolone and Warfarin the same chemical, or different with the same result?

**350RRC** · 24th June 2021, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by V8Ian

I read, the other day, that the Fed's denied NSW's request to approve a certain type of poison* to combat the current mouse plague.

* I don't recall the scientific name, but it's a poison that blocks the production of vitamin K resulting in death by internal bleeding.
Ratsac is the domestic version, which shares its main component with a blood thinning medication.

I think I read it on the digital ABC news site, if you want to search.

No, no and no.

The AVPMA blocked the use of brodione in NSW. They are the non-political body overseeing the use of pesticides and herbicides in Oz.

There are two types of rodenticides, type 1 (like Ratsak... warfurin) and type 2 (brodifacoum, brodiolone, etc).

The type 2's have a very long half life and will kill birds of prey that feed on poisoned carcasses.

Good marketing, supermarket shelves empty of the 'one hit type 2's' every year from April on around here when rats and mice become a problem when they move indoors. Skies empty of swamp harriers, whistling kites, etc around here compared with 10 years ago.

Type 2's are apparently banned in the EU and even the US because of the effect they have on the natural predators that prey on rats and mice.

Ratsak double strength (warfurin) works fine and won't do so much collateral damage.

Only speaking from experience. DL

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