Thread: This is fair justice

There are however, those prisoners who being totally unable to fit into society before they were caught for their crimes, are actually relieved to be in a secure environment when they go to prison. For the first time in their lives, they don't have to worry about responsibility - keeping a job, paying bills, supplying/cooking meals, clothing themselves, maintaining relationships, etc, etc, etc. They are totally incapable of sustaining "normal" lives for any period of time. To them, prison is an enormous weight off their shoulders.

As is often the case, the more serious the crime (murder, serial murder etc), the more dysfunctional the person is & the more they crave the "security" that prison provides.

Some prisoners, feel totally bewildered when faced with the prospect of being released, as they are unable to function in society, which is most often the reason for their crimes in the first place.

Originally Posted by solmanic

For the benefit of those here who have had no contact with the correctional system, there is no such thing as "easy time". Even if you are locked up in a five star holiday resort, the fact is you can not go down to the shops/movies/away on holidays or anywhere! Deprivation of liberty alone is enough to do your head in over time.

Sure, some people may feel bitter resentment to a prisoner who is in a "comfy" cell with cable TV and three square meals a day (even if dinner is a 4:30 in the afternoon). If so, then go outside and take a walk to the park or go play with your kids or dog. You have just demonstrated why life in a crappy environment outside is better than life in any form of prison.

Who cares about how we run prisons?

Let's run schools like this.

The sensible path is the path of balance & comprimise made by those of differing opinions being free and safe to express those opinions, in the light of all this, we speak and listen, give and take, and nobody has a monopoly on wisdom.

I hereby volunteer to balance out the most arty farty, luvvie dovie, touchy feely ,radio national listening, tree hugging, peace loving, let them all in, sandal wearing person in Australia by being the economic driest Bush-lovingist, anti-union, country invader, redneck in Australia.

It's tough unpopular work but somebody has to do it.

people are products of their environment ! looking to the states for answers is not a good idea look at the stats about JAILS in the u.s. alot of them are run at a profit because most of them are privately owned yes as a business so some one is getting rich from peoples misfortune ......understanding crims and why people commit crimes can lead to preventing more crime .prevention is greater than a cure .think with your brain and not your emotions

Very good point. However, in Utopia prevention is greater than cure, but unfortunately, you would have to totally change society as we know it, as there are so many factors which lead to crime in the first place.

Originally Posted by defmec

people are products of their environment ! looking to the states for answers is not a good idea look at the stats about JAILS in the u.s. alot of them are run at a profit because most of them are privately owned yes as a business so some one is getting rich from peoples misfortune ......understanding crims and why people commit crimes can lead to preventing more crime .prevention is greater than a cure .think with your brain and not your emotions

Originally Posted by stevo68

Sorry, did I say that?? Had a quick squizz back and pretty sure I didn't. The point I was trying to make is that, those countries where they are extreme have very low crime rates, compared to countries like ours where we have a more "left" wing approach to punishment. Could we perhaps take a more harsher approach to crime and the relevant punishment.......I think so. 30 odd years ago, if I back chatted my teacher, I would have got the cane........it was very rare, if at all anyone did. Those that did tended to be on the "denser" side . Is it so rare now....or is it relatively common place? A quick chat to my 9 and 10 yr old who tell me about the behaviour of other children at school is appalling.

Regards

Stevo

Stevo

Number one, get a statistic. Even Wiki stats would be fine, but if you're going to make the argument back it up with some evidence other than your opinion.

Number two, democracy.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

At what point point does the punishment equal the crime in barbarity?

When that happens are we as a society not worse, or at least equal to the perpetrator of the crime?

Democracy is all about the greatest good for the greatest number, partly because the victim of the crime is unlikely to respond in a balanced and judicial manner.

An individual breaks the laws of our society, we refrain from stooping to their level, we deny them free access to our society, we recognise that judgements can be flawed, sometimes those declared guilty are actually innocent, sometimes those who appear to be incorrigible serve their sentence and go on to contribute something of value to society.

Cheers
Simon

Originally Posted by abaddonxi

Stevo

Number one, get a statistic. Even Wiki stats would be fine, but if you're going to make the argument back it up with some evidence other than your opinion.

Number two, democracy.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

At what point point does the punishment equal the crime in barbarity?

When that happens are we as a society not worse, or at least equal to the perpetrator of the crime?

Democracy is all about the greatest good for the greatest number, partly because the victim of the crime is unlikely to respond in a balanced and judicial manner.

An individual breaks the laws of our society, we refrain from stooping to their level, we deny them free access to our society, we recognise that judgements can be flawed, sometimes those declared guilty are actually innocent, sometimes those who appear to be incorrigible serve their sentence and go on to contribute something of value to society.

Cheers
Simon

As you insisted of Stevo, what percentage of these are innocent or go on to lead constructive lives.

I suspect only a very small percentage, which means your love affair of the current system is some what flawed, but what the hell, this is just my opinion being wagged against your opinion.

Stevo

Number one, get a statistic. Even Wiki stats would be fine, but if you're going to make the argument back it up with some evidence other than your opinion.

Hi Simon, hows about you take your number one and shove it up your jatzy. If you cared to read back, I did note some countries with very low crime rates based on their way of handing out punishment. I actually even spent 20 mins reading first, wasn't aware that I had to go and rack up pages of stats. So Simon, do not "talk" to me like I am some kind on inane idiot....ta .

Number 2..... though Drivesafe put it better than me

Democracy is all about the greatest good for the greatest number, partly because the victim of the crime is unlikely to respond in a balanced and judicial manner.

An individual breaks the laws of our society, we refrain from stooping to their level, we deny them free access to our society, we recognise that judgements can be flawed, sometimes those declared guilty are actually innocent, sometimes those who appear to be incorrigible serve their sentence and go on to contribute something of value to society.

Umm excuse me Simon, is that your opinion...care to back that with a stat or two...I will take Stats For Dummies, or was it a cut and paste from an online dictionary....cheers,

Regards

Stevo

Originally Posted by stevo68

Hi Simon, hows about you take your number one and shove it up your jatzy. If you cared to read back, I did note some countries with very low crime rates based on their way of handing out punishment. I actually even spent 20 mins reading first, wasn't aware that I had to go and rack up pages of stats. So Simon, do not "talk" to me like I am some kind on inane idiot....ta .

Stevo, you talk and talk about open debate and taking it with a smile.

BTW don't think you're an idiot, sorry that you took it that way.

Number 2..... though Drivesafe put it better than me Umm excuse me Simon, is that your opinion...care to back that with a stat or two...I will take Stats For Dummies, or was it a cut and paste from an online dictionary....cheers,

Regards

Stevo

That one is actually a compliment, all my own silver-tongued words, sorry, no quotes.

I guess I didn't include statistics since what I am talking about is philosophy of democracy, and most of it was written a couple of thousand years ago by a couple of playwrights, before statistics was really invented.

What I understood you to be talking about is the actual difference in success between styles of judicial punishment and incarceration.

So, again, show me some links, point me to the statistics. I'm interested in what you've got to say, but I'd like to see some evidence.

And for my simple link-
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Cheers
Simon