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Actually a large percentage of machines fail either early in there life or completely randomly. 56,000km could almost be classified as infant mortalityQuote:
Originally Posted by letherm
Studies but the airline industry in the 70's found that most failures (around 70%) are infant mortality (trend F below). The next larges failure mode is the trend E below, which are random failures. Machines do fail and most of your warranty periods are there to cover the "infant mortality" of your car
There may be something in these threads but i have not trawled through.
Google sa 4x4 community disco 3 engine failures
Cheers
HiAll,
After much back and forth, and speaking to a number of people, it appears that the cause of the issue is actually two things coming together;
1.Bearings not being made to specification, thereby reducing oil pressure at that bearing and increasing wear at that point.
2.Oil cooler partially blocked by silicon used to seal the engine during manufacture, restricting flow and impacting oil circulation.
(note that the silicon issue affects water coolers also)
These two items together have then resulted in excessive temperature at the bearing site. I am speculating, but I believe that the as the oil is not as constricted as it should be with that bearing, the oil pressure is not reduced enough (pressure is reduced and flow is increased as fluid passes through a constriction) to enable the oil to flow properly through between the bearing and the crank (as the total flow is limited and the remaining flow takes the path of least resistance via the other bearings).
I have now sourced a complete replacement engine from a 2015 D4 with only 3000km on it - as a result I plan to keep the D4 for the time being. If all goes well, the engine will hopefully be fitted next week.
The people I am getting the engine from have recommended that every 50000km all the oil and water radiators are either replaced or cleaned (one of them sealed and cannot be serviced). I will be doing this from now on, as well as the transmission filter change (aftermarket filter as OEM is non-serviceable) I was already doing every 50000km.
I have raised the issue with Land Rover, who refuse to confirm or deny that there is any kind of problem at all. Despite Consumer Law in Australia clearly stating that a manufacturer or importer of goods is responsible for ensuring that those goods meet reasonable expectations of durability, they have also refused to assist with my claim in any way. From a letter to me from Land Rover Australia; "we have no expected timeframe for the life of individual components" and "we consider it a natural part of vehicle maintenance and use". Put simply, a total and catastrophic engine failure after only 100000km is not surprising to Land Rover Australia, and therefore my claim is not valid.
Given that Land Rover have complete engines ready in Australia, waiting to be installed, I would also speculate that they have already had to do a number of these under warranty. In addition, these engines are not new, but remanufactured, further supporting this assertion. The cost of one of these, and all the other parts you need to resolve this failure, is around $50,000.
Furthermore, the high demand for these engines from wrecked vehicles is keeping the price very high, again supporting an unexpected level of failures.
I intend to keep pursuing Land Rover, both via legal and media options available to me. If anyone hasn't had this problem, I would recommend that you get your radiators cleaned or replaced asap, in an effort to avoid it. If you have had this problem, it would be great if you could get in touch as I think a combined approach to put pressure on Land Rover Australia would be more effective.
Note also that I shared this post with Land Rover Australia several days prior to posting, but they declined to comment.
As I continue on this journey, I will keep you all updated on this forum.
Thanks for your help,
John
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevejames
When I was talking to their customer service people, a key assessment of whether they would help or not was 'loyalty to the brand'. I would suggest that if you bought the vehicle new, and have used a dealer for servicing, you have a lot of brand loyalty.
Do you also have the 3.0 SDV6? Note that in a mistaken response from Land Rover, it also appears that they have a similar issue with the Freelander 2 - wondering how far it extends...
Hope this helps,
John
Just file a court claim after engaging a solicitor to write a letter reserving your rights. The legal dept may have a different view.
Check the limits of small claims in your state. If within that jurisdiction file there.
Hi there
For my first ever post I wish it was a happier one.
Our ones in at the local Landrover dealer after coming to a halt while towing our caravan. It has seized with a possible cause being a broken crank. It has done 159,000 kms and is a 2010 3 litre.
The dealer is removing the engine and then the sump to see if they can determine what has gone wrong. They drained the oil looking for metal in it but found nothing and commented the oil seemed a little thick. I have taken an oil sample and may have it tested.
Reading through this thread I am not very hopeful Landrover will be helping me out but we will wait and see what the damage is and run it past them anyway.
Thanks Throwaway for starting this thread.
Ian
Bugger, I wish you luck with Land Rover but it is unlikely they will do anything post warranty. I think the only hope would be if you have always had it serviced by a dealer or if fault can be found in the servicing.
Hope it gets sorted out to your satisfaction.
202,000km on my engine does not seem so bad now :twisted:
QA on these highly stressed engines seems to be marginal.
surely "implied warranty" and fit for purpose comes into play?
Seems there are a lot of people with similar issues, perhaps getting towards a class action?
This is really starting to worry me as I have a 2010 3.0 D4. Starting to think about trading it, but on what? I know every make has it's problems but is it just me or does the "engine failure" scenario seem to be more prevalent?