Thread: Suspension Lift Options D4

Originally Posted by BennyF

Next I looked at the LLAMS solution and on the surface, it looked like a no brainer... but then I read that there may be complications regarding insurance and legality

Never heard that suggestion before so I can only assume that someone has their own agenda. There's no difference between LLAMS and temporary use of different height calibrations via the Gap tool except that LLAMs is simpler and faster to switch on and off just by rotating a knob.

However you may want to get a diagnostic tool first for its diagnostic capabilities and occasional use of other height calibrations then if use warrants, get LLAMS later.

Originally Posted by Graeme

Never heard that suggestion before so I can only assume that someone has their own agenda. There's no difference between LLAMS and temporary use of different height calibrations via the Gap tool except that LLAMs is simpler and faster to switch on and off just by rotating a knob.

However you may want to get a diagnostic tool first for its diagnostic capabilities and occasional use of other height calibrations then if use warrants, get LLAMS later.

Yes I too was surprised by the conversation on here (a thread dedicated to it from memory). I did have to step back and think “there are a LOT of people on this forum that have LLAMS and they’d presumably be insured”.

If it turns out that there are no legal/insurance issues, then it rockets to equal first for my requirements.

My reckoning with the various options are;

Rods- cheap, simple, a little inconvenient.
LLAMS - expensive, single use (ie it only does lift), very convenient, hardest to install. It's my preferred choice.
GAP Tool- expensive, multiple uses (I suggest it's a must have whether you want lift or not), fiddly to use (need to plug in device, get phone out, use software), to change settings you have to do all this again.

My take on the insurance side of things is, all of these devices are not doing anything different to what you can do with the buttons in the car except is lowers >40km/h. People do suspension lifts with springs and shocks all the time and have no insurance issues, except possibly stupidly high lifts.

Originally Posted by BennyF

Hi all - first post on this forum. I’ve been reading for a while so I know I’m reaching out to the right people.

I’ve recently purchased a 2015 Disco 3.0L TDV6. It’ll be used primarily as a family car but I will most definitely be getting it off-road so I need to get it up to spec.

I’ve got a long (and very expensive) list of ‘must haves’ and ‘nice to haves’. For the most part, it’s a simple matter of my prioritising what I can afford and when.

One issue I keep bumping into is the lift kit. I’ve looked at various lift rods and electronic variable solutions like LLAMS. Each option appears to be good but with some trade offs.

Lifting with rods is essentially a full time lift which isn’t ideal for the day to day that I need to do (3 and 4yr olds getting into the rig). I’ve also been advised that I’ll get a much tougher ride as the bags and I love the soft ride I currently have. Are they easy enough to pop on when heading off-road or is it not recommended?

Next I looked at the LLAMS solution and on the surface, it looked like a no brainer... but then I read that there may be complications regarding insurance and legality. I’m a legit Safety Sam so if there’s a risk insurance will be compromised, I unfortunately can’t consider it.

That takes me to the GAP IID solution to adjust the lift heights. I think it looks brilliant. I’m pretty solid with technology so the interface and tech aspects don’t intimidate me. If there is a risk with insurance, it’ll be mitigated by me simply inserting and removing the device when it’s needed - which would be limited to tougher terrain and crossings (I assume?).

What are people’s thoughts on these options in the context of having the best, temporary solution for when you need it - rather than a permanent 2.5-3” lift.

Does ongoing use of the GAP IID solution in anyway compromise the ECU? Can you over do it? Can the plug wear from repeated use? Anyone experience any weird issues with it?

Your opinions and advice is much appreciated.

Cheers

Hi BennyF

Welcome to the forum

My personal experience is that I was going to buy the LLAMS kit due to the cost of the GAPIID tool at the time and the GAPIID not being Blue Tooth. I also had another GAPIID type tool at the time called a Nanocom which is very similar in functionality. My main use is to lower the car to make access better for my wife. Possible on the Nanocom but tedious at the time. Excellent on the LLAMS as it's just the turn of a knob. I ended up going with the GAPIID though as it later came out in a blue tooth version and the cost differential was then minimal and it has the added functions inherent in it that were not in the LLAMS. I can drop the car (D4 2013) to its bump stops with the GAPIID using the app on my phone in about 5 taps. Launch app, connect to tool, select Height Control, select bump stops, confirm. All up about 20 or 30 seconds. The longest part is waiting for the suspension to get down to bump stops. I sold the nanocom to a forum member. Personally it was a better option a I got the suspension alterations I needed and also had a diagnostic tool that I could use through my phone.

There is a warning on the GAPIID site about leaving the tool plugged in all the time. Another member here queried this and it is because if you don't turn off the tool it will keep looking for a connection and can drain your car battery. I bought mine in April 2017 and it has been permanently plugged in since then. I had my car serviced today (6 years and 2 months since I bought it and had the battery replaced as a precautionary measure as it was showing signs of degradation. Obviously having the tool plugged in has had no effect. That said I have forgotten to disconnect (to clarify, I mean through the app not by physically disconnecting it) a few times and later remembered and gone out to the car to disconnect it. The position of the obiid port is inconvenient and would cause a problem if the tool was connected there. I bought a flat extension ribbon cable and it sit underneath the steering wheel behind the cover panel.

Bottom line is that either solution will work. The GAPIID was my choice because of added functions and I'm happy to wait a few seconds to use a phone rather than a simple knob twist. Some people do not want to wait and of course you would need to stop to use a mobile phone unless you have a passenger. Once again I would be happy to wait for the added functionality gains. You can of course leave the tool "on" while you're driving as your battery is in no danger of discharging while the engine is running.

Very much a personal circumstances choice but that's my experience.

HTH

Regards,
Martin

Benny - if you have issues with LLAMs then you must have issues with any type of lift as the issues you mention apply to them all.

Garry

I used GAP as I only need to permanently raise my vehicle for off-road travel a couple of times a year. I don’t need to lower like some regularly. For me GAP does the job. Takes longer, but I set it +40mm at the start of the holiday and reset at the end. Simple. In the in between I use the standard height buttons to gain further height if required.

The dual purpose of GAP makes it the right investment for me for my infrequent use.

“I’d only fit it when going offroad etc”

Huh?!?!? So when most likely to damage the vehicle you would fit something you’re worried would potentially make insurance invalid (BtW, it won’t cause ANY insurance issues).

GAP tool first, Suspension controller second.

Originally Posted by Tombie

“I’d only fit it when going offroad etc”

Huh?!?!? So when most likely to damage the vehicle you would fit something you’re worried would potentially make insurance invalid (BtW, it won’t cause ANY insurance issues).

GAP tool first, Suspension controller second.

I’d argue that I’m more likely to have an insurance event on the road during day to day driving. I’ve been off-roading for years and while things break, fail and go wrong, we’ve never had to lodge an claim.

I’ll have a chat to Club 4x4 and get their perspective. If they’re OK with a LLAMS kit, then the grey areas should be cleared (for me anyway).

Thanks to everyone else for their input.