Matilda's jammed rear drum brakes

[Scallops]

Hello Folks,

Went for my debut drive in Matilda this arvo - had one fella actually flag me down to check the car out and to offer me an army jerry can for Matilda! Isn't that amazing? Anyhow, got as far as Walloon (from Ipswich) The rear brakes jammed on again - so the following piccies details my day out in the old girl.....



At least it was a nice day....



Anyhow, once home I put 'Tilly up on the axle stands, removed the rear wheels, and took the drums off. This is what I found....and please correct me if I'm wrong here....

1) Both rear brakes - leading shoe doesn't have the post that faces the backing plate - the trailing shoes do.

2) So the trailing shoes have the top spring attached, and the spring goes to the post on the backing plate, but

3) The post that comes from the backing plate, to which the other end of the top spring attaches - is at the front of the drum - behind the leading shoe.

So - I conclude that some moron, in the past, has put a passenger side brake on the driver's side and visa - versa.

How does my theory sound to you guys?

At any rate, things are pretty good, considering....

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eDaSvRO9xA&feature=player_embedded"]YouTube- Original 4 Yorkshiremen Sketch[/nomedia]

[JDNSW]

It definitely sounds as if the right and left brakes have been interchanged.

A question - when the brakes locked, did you try backing to release them?

John

[Scallops]

It definitely sounds as if the right and left brakes have been interchanged.

A question - when the brakes locked, did you try backing to release them?

John

Thanks so much John - I was almost too scared to post this thinking I didn't have a clue.

Yes - I reversed along the verge which did indeed release the brakes - enough to get her winched onto the tilt tray.

Now I know I'm onto it, I also am thinking I can just unbolt the entire drum from the axle, disconnect the brake cylinders, and swap them over.

Thanks again for your reply.

[Dinty]

G'day All, I'm going out for a short run in 'Chloe' tomorrow, hope this brake curse doen't follow me LOL, anyway the only MORON I can blame will be ME , hope you fix yours soon mate cheers and fingers XXXXXX'd 4 2 morrow, Dennis

[zulu Delta 534]

That would mean that the backing / anchor plates are fitted to the axle housing on the wrong sides as the spring anchor pin is fitted to the anchor plate assembly, and not just simply the brake shoes back to front.
Did you back up straight away or was there an elapsed time before you reversed?
Dan, you also mentioned that the pedal was rock hard when the lock up occurred, which still reeks to me of a blockage in a hydraulic brake line not allowing fluid return.
Would be interested in hearing other's thoughts, armed with the full symptoms.
Regards
Glen

[JDNSW]

......
Dan, you also mentioned that the pedal was rock hard when the lock up occurred, which still reeks to me of a blockage in a hydraulic brake line not allowing fluid return.
Would be interested in hearing other's thoughts, armed with the full symptoms.
Regards
Glen

Glen,
If the leading shoe is locked against the drum, there will be no fluid returning as the shoe is not returning, so this would not follow. Also, with a blockage, reversing would not free it, although your comment about the possible delay might mask this.

Dan,

You will have to pull the halfaxles as well, but you probably realise that.

John

[Scallops]

Glen - that's what I mean - the backing plates - the entire setup - they are back to front. But to be perfectly accurate - the shoes themelves aren't back to front - looking at the brake as a single entity - it's setup right - just on the wrong side of the vehicle - perhaps a little hard to get across in the written form - I'll show you.

In regard to the actual incident - I backed up immediately - didn't do anything much - but did free them a little. Waited until the brakes had a chance to cool, or really, get cooler and did it again - they hadn't come off fully then either, but they were still a long way off cold - however, the brakes had released enough to be winched onto the tilt tray.

I think it was just that with cooling they contracted off the drums, as they had done since my drive from Buccan until this morning's test drive, Glen.

Maybe the flexible rear brake hose does needs replacing - but the fact remains - the entire brake setups are on the wrong side - something missed by us when we inspected it initially and by the mechanic who changed the entire drum housing last week. But, for the record - I don't think the hose is the issue at all - both rear brakes are on the wrong side of the vehicle - that is why they are jamming! Now - I'm sure you guys are fully aware of this, but when a trailing shoe is leading and the brake is applied, the shoes can rotate up and jam the drum; Seems consistent with what has happened.

John - didn't realise I'd need to pull the half axles - don't even know what they are, although I think I can guess/work out what you are saying. I think I'll be awaiting the expert help before proceeding.

Thanks again for the advice.

[Scallops]

Another question - is "pulling the half axles", as John has explained I'll need to do in order to swap the rear passenger side brake with the rear driver's side brake, something that can be easily done at home? Will it require any specialist tools, for example?

It's just that I was going to spend today cleaning up my 5 wheels - removing the paint and crud - in order to etch prime and paint them as per the rest of the vehicle. I was then going to take the wheels back to the HoHars, as that is where the paint gun and paint actually is, so if I go ahead with today's plan I'll be without my wheels for a time.

But if this job is going to require someone external, like MR, to become involved, I will need my wheels to get the vehicle onto a car trailer.

So - I have spanners and sockets - will simple everyday tools and some guidance get me through this, ie - is this going to be relatively easy?

[JDNSW]

Another question - is "pulling the half axles", as John has explained I'll need to do in order to swap the rear passenger side brake with the rear driver's side brake, something that can be easily done at home? Will it require any specialist tools, for example?

It's just that I was going to spend today cleaning up my 5 wheels - removing the paint and crud - in order to etch prime and paint them as per the rest of the vehicle. I was then going to take the wheels back to the HoHars, as that is where the paint gun and paint actually is, so if I go ahead with today's plan I'll be without my wheels for a time.

But if this job is going to require someone external, like MR, to become involved, I will need my wheels to get the vehicle onto a car trailer.

So - I have spanners and sockets - will simple everyday tools and some guidance get me through this, ie - is this going to be relatively easy?

Jack up rear on stands (front wheels chocked.
Remove rear wheels
Clamp brake hose to rear axle (special clamp available from tool shop)
Drain rear diff oil
Remove brake drums (keep theses with the brake they came off)
Remove brake shoes
Undo hydraulic line to wheel cylinder
Undo bolts holding backing plate and wheel bearing to axle housing
Remove half axle
Remove backing plate
Repeat for other side
Swap backing plate, brake shoes and springs, brake drum, to other side.
Reassemble in reverse order
Bleed brakes
Refill rear axle.

I don't think I have missed anything.

John

[numpty]

I'm not sure, but if you look in my S1 manual, which Glen has, it should show the assembly. I do have a parts manual as well, which will show it, but it is 1100 k's away at the moment.