Oils - can we set up a definitive list

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Originally Posted by ScottW

I spent a couple of hours searching through the 10-20 oil threads, trying to find what was best for the engine, gearbox, transfer, rover diff and sals diff. Different threads give different opinions, some are also incorrect of outdated. Having a complete list in one spot would be very handy.

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How is a single list going to be any different ?

You will have people submitting oils that others will disagree with for various reasons and the reality is there is no such thing as 'best'.
Most people use an oil and say "it's good" just because an engine/gearbox/diff hasn't gone BANG, but mostly an opinion is based on an emotional response to justify a purchasing decision.
A manual gearbox may be a little different as you can feel the action of the synchro's when shifting gears, but even that is only one part of the oils job, it's main purpose is to reduce/eliminate wear, and unless you are doing used oil analysis and teardowns to measure wear, we are still only guessing on an outcome.

Case in point, IMO the heavier engine oils like HPR15 or HPR Diesel in a 2/300tdi are a nonsense, an oil that heavy just isn't needed and may in fact be counter productive but plenty of people on here use it and are really happy with it, yet to me it's a triumph of marketing over substance.

The other problem the forum will face is that with the various sub forums now, a lot of tech issues have been re-directed to them and we are getting multiple oil/tech questions occurring almost simultaneously.
Maybe a sticky (not another one :D) at the top of each forum with a link to the list in The Good Oil ?
Although experience from another forum shows quite a few miss or just don't look at the stickies.

Oil selection isn't that hard, stick to recommended hot viscosities and modern specs (most LR ones are outdated/superseded)
If we can educate on how to read an oil bottle, or better yet a PDS/TDS, then a person can make an informed decision and still bring the emotional side into their purchase by using their preferred brand.

There will never be such a beast as a definitive list, only a suggested list based on a bunch of opinions and that will change yearly as oil standards develop and the marketing boys change labels and names and at the end of the day people need to be free to choose what they want, which also depends on what's available locally.
If they stick to recommended viscosities and modern specs they really can't go wrong.

Anyway, someone will have to maintain it and update it and the mods have enough on their plates already...
Bags not me :lol2:



Anyway, a link to some of my oil ramblings with some ideas on what I think makes a good lube. http://www.aulro.com/afvb/good-oil/7...g-rick130.html

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Originally Posted by rick130

<snip!>

Oil selection isn't that hard, stick to recommended hot viscosities and modern specs (most LR ones are outdated/superseded)
If we can educate on how to read an oil bottle, or better yet a PDS/TDS, then a person can make an informed decision and still bring the emotional side into their purchase by using their preferred brand.

<snip!>

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Now if we could just find someone to write the definitive guide on how to read the label of an oil can.:angel:

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Originally Posted by abaddonxi

Now if we could just find someone to write the definitive guide on how to read the label of an oil can.:angel:

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Cut and paste from a previous post/s :p

Fair enough! lets not bother then.

I pretty much know what oils I need for my cars so I'm happy enough.

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Originally Posted by Psimpson7

Fair enough! lets not bother then.

I pretty much know what oils I need for my cars so I'm happy enough.

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Pete, please don't take what I wrote the wrong way, it's a good idea as we are seeing multiple oil requests daily ATM, I just gets bloody hard to do.

JB has his low viscosity oil chart for gearboxes but it's off forum and I'm not even sure if he's a member here but we could ask if we could make a permanent link to it.

I could bodgy a list of suitable viscosities/standards for each spot too.

I started to do it at the bottom of the last post, but it's doubling up on stuff I've already posted elsewhere.

I could pull all that together into one post/thread.

thoughts ?

I reckon Petes idea is awesome ,like Pete i know what exact oils to put in mine aswell as a few alturnatives so its no advantage to me but there are a **** load :wasntme:of people out there who want alturntatives or just simply help Rick130 i am sure you are probarly extremely experienced in oils and i search your posts for half hour with no real help in what i should use in my car ,i did find it eventually after reading pages and pages ,,,but dont you think a list with the help from you and other oil gurus be so much better .... the heading can change to something like "OILS RECOMMENDED FOR YOUR LAND ROVER BY FORUM MEMBERS"
Pete i reckon you should continue i think it a top idea
cheers Kelvin

Bingo! that's me !

(see servicing a 300Tdi Defender thread in the Defender forum).

I want to know what oilds I should use.. talk about can worms.
Let's say I decided to use Castrol oils to narrow it down a bit...

Feel free to repond in the thread in the Defrender forum, ideally. Cheers.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130...-defender.html

I feel a bit guilty as Petes reccomendation to me i think sparked his idea!

I'm not sure a definitive list is ever going to happen, but i think what Pete was getting at is a list that states what people have used and like, you still have to make a selection but you have a choice.. if you need to it gives you starting point for searching... ie search for syntrans etc...

I spent hours looking and getting confused.. but finally went with petes recomendation (and others) of syntrans in the r380 and penrite hypoid in the diff and transfer.. im a happy bloke as the gearbox is now transformed and the diff / transfer whine is reduced from before..

I know what Rick means that its only my opinion and i am only measuring performance on a very simple scale, not on wear characteristics etc.. but the main point for me is its a starting point for me to find an oil and its specs (and volume) to go in said parts....

Now did i achive anything there? or type words and say nothing? :p

Steve

[snip]



Ok:

Engines // Refil capacity // oil 1 // oil 2 // oil 3 // oil 4

2.25p // 6l //
2.25d // 6l //
2.5p // 6l //
2.5d // 6l //
2.5td //
2.6p // 6.8l //
200tdi // 6.85 // Penrite HPR15 //Caltex Delo 400 15W-40// Caltex Delo 400 LE 15W-40// Mobil Delvac MX ESP 15W-40// Mobil Delvac MX 15W-40// Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5W-40// Castrol RX Super 15W-40// Castrol Tection Global ES 15W-40// Castrol Tection Global 15W-40// Castrol Hypuron 15W-40// Castrol Diesel X 15W-40// Penrite Diesel SP 10W-40// Penrite Diesel LA 15W-40// Penrite SIN Diesel 5W-40// Fuchs Titan Ultralube 15W-40// Fuchs Titan Ultra MC 10W-40// Fuchs Titan Cargo MC 10W-40// Fuchs Titan Universal MF 15W-40// Fuchs Titan Universal HD 15W-40
300tdi // 6.85 // Penrite HPR15 //Caltex Delo 400 15W-40// Caltex Delo 400 LE 15W-40// Mobil Delvac MX ESP 15W-40// Mobil Delvac MX 15W-40// Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5W-40// Castrol RX Super 15W-40// Castrol Tection Global ES 15W-40// Castrol Tection Global 15W-40// Castrol Hypuron 15W-40// Castrol Diesel X 15W-40// Penrite Diesel SP 10W-40// Penrite Diesel LA 15W-40// Penrite SIN Diesel 5W-40// Fuchs Titan Ultralube 15W-40// Fuchs Titan Ultra MC 10W-40// Fuchs Titan Cargo MC 10W-40// Fuchs Titan Universal MF 15W-40// Fuchs Titan Universal HD 15W-40
TD5 // 8.2 // Penrite HPR 5 // Valvoline Synpower 5w40 // Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5W-40// Mobil Delvac XHP LE 10W-40// Castrol Enduron Low SAPS 10W-40// Penrite SIN Diesel 5W-40// Penrite Diesel SP 10W-40// Fuchs Titan cargo MC 10W-40// Castrol Edge Sport 0W-40

Puma // 6.3l //
Gearboxes // Refil capacity // oil 1 // oil 2 // oil 3 // oil 4

Series 4 spd //
Lt77 // 2.6l //
Lt85 // 3.1l //
Lt95 // 2.6l //
R380 // 2.7l // Castrol SynTrans 75w85 // Penrite Manual gear oil 75 // Valvoline Duragear 75w85 Syn // Texaco MTF94 // Castrol VMX80// Penrite SIN Manual Tans Fluid 75W-85// Castrol Syntrans B 75W-80// Castrol Syntrans Max 75W-80// Castrol SMX-O// Redline MTL 70W-80// Redline MT90 75W-90 (if noisy in summer, eg gear rattle when hot, can also be blended with MTL)// Motul Gear 300 75W-90 (excellent at low and high operating temps)// Torco RTF 75W-90 (for hot weather/high load use only, may cause baulking in some 'boxes)// Amsoil MTF 75W-80// Shell Spirax GSX 75W-80// Fuchs Titan Supergear 75W-85

Puma 6spd //

Transfer cases // Refil capacity // oil 1 // oil 2 // oil 3 // oil 4

LT95 // 3.1l //
LT230 // 2.3-2.7l // Castrol EXP80w90 // Penrite Hypoid 80w90// Castrol Syntrax 75W-90// Castrol Multitrax 75W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 80W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 75W-90// Neo HD 75W-90// Amsoil Severe Gear 75W-90// Amsoil MTG// Torco RTF 75W-90//

Diffs // Refil capacity // oil 1 // oil 2 // oil 3 // oil 4

Rover // 1.7l // Penrite Hypoid 80w90 // Castrol Syntrax 75w90 //
Amsoil Severe gear 75w90 // Penrite Limslip 85w140// Castrol Syntrax 75W-90// Castrol Multitrax 75W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 80W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 75W-90// Neo HD 75W-90// Amsoil Severe Gear 75W-90// Amsoil MTG// Torco RTF 75W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear HLS 75W-90
Salisbury // 2.5l // Penrite Hypoid 80w90 // Castrol SAF-XA 80W-140 (particularly if using a cast iron diff cover, eg RockCrusher, Solid, ARB, etc) Castrol SAF-XJ 75W-140// Castrol SAF-XO 75W-90// Castrol Syntrax 75W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 80W-90// Fuchs Titan Gear 75W-90// Neo 75W-90HD // Amsoil Severe Gear 75W-90// Amsoil MTG// Torco RTF 75W-90// Caltex Delo Synthetic Gear Oil 75W-90 and 80W-140// Caltex Synthetic Gear FM 75W-140// Mobil Delvac Synthetic Gear oil 75W-90// Mobil Delvac Synthetic Gear Oil 75W-140// Fuchs Titan Gear HLS 75W-90// Fuchs Titan Supergear 85W-140...


Brief outline on choosing oils for your diesel Defender or Disco.

Tdi's = any decent 5W-40, 10W-40, 15W-40 diesel oil of API CH-4, CI-4, CI-4+, CJ-4 (CF-4 is OK but ideally a CI-4 or better spec is best IMO) or an ACEA B3/B4, (passenger car diesel/light commercial) E4, E7 diesel oil (heavy duty diesel) or combination thereof.

Basically the further into the alphabet or higher the number, the higher the spec, so a CI-4+ oil outperforms a CF-4 at the extremes of performance and the better engine oils in the list above are the 5W-40's and 10W-40's.

TD5's = a good 0W-40, 5W-40, 10W-40 or 5W-50 engine oil with at least an ACEA A1/B1 but if the oil meets the A3/B3/B4 spec this is preferable.

For the best protection an ACEA E4 or E4/E7 oil can be used. These are heavy duty diesel oils with the E7 spec indicating suitable for extended drains so are very high quality oils. The E7 spec includes a test for wear at high soot levels, extra corrosion and oxidation tests and better piston cleanliness standard than the E4 spec.

Under 35*C ambient a 5W-30 or 10W-30 may be used if meeting the ACEA A3/B3/B4 specs.

R380 = 70W-80, 75W-80, 75W-85 or some 75W-90 GL-4 Manual Trans Fluids or the odd dual rated GL-4/GL-5 manual transmission fluid as listed above.
DO NOT USE A DIFF/GEAR OIL, THE CORRECT OIL WILL STATE "MANUAL TRANSMISSION (or Transaxle) FLUID" on the bottle.

T/case. Any 75W-90, 80W-90, SAE 90, either GL-4 or dual rated GL4/GL-5

Diffs. Must be a GL-5 or dual rated GL4/GL-5 oil of either a 75W-90, 80W-90, SAE90. LSD fluids are OK to use. A straight GL-4 oil isn't robust enough for a diff, containing only 2/3 the EP/AW additive levels of a GL-5 diff oil.
75W-110// 75W-140// 80W-140 are OK in a Sals diff.
My preference is for a 75W-110 (if you can find one) or an 80W-140 in a Sals diff when towing and when using a cast diff cover. These things get bloody hot due to the high hypoid action of the pinion and crown wheel.


Probably the best starting point for any oil recommendation is your owners manual concerning the required viscosities, and next is the oil blenders website where all the major companies have an interactive "What oil do I use ?" selector.

{edit} oops, accidentally hit submit... and there's great oils by Total/Elf, Conoco-Phillips, Shell, BP, all the boutique blenders, etc etc. Hopefully someone can list a few suitable ones.

When did LR change from Sals rear to Rover ? I have a 1995 Landie with Sals rear and the 1996 manual I have says diff capacity F&R is 1.7 litres - denoting rover diffs at both ends I imagine.