Thread: HS 2.8L TGV - any opinions ?

Originally Posted by wrinklearthur

Hi Tony

I have found that the material, used in the construction of the big end bearing, as fitted to the 300TDi, does not last long, if the engine ever has had water contaminated oil.

Inspecting all of these bearing shells from a blown 300 TDi motor and comparing them to the bearings from a V8 Perkins, that also had water contamination, the exact same damage was caused to both motors.

The soft alloy bearing material, bonded to the steel shell had pock marked and delaminated, then balled up breaking the big end bolts, this let a conrod go, with it coming out through the side of the block.

This posting isn't a criticism of only the 300 TDi, but rather is a warning to those that have had water in their motors, of all types and makes.
They should have their motors bottom end looked at, if they don't want their motor to fail catastrophically.

Cheers Arthur

Arthur, some Tdi's just do big ends.

JC reckons there was a batch, appears to be the last six months of '98 that destroy big ends and cranks.

I had my shells let go and luckily didn't do the crank too and AFAIK no water had ever entered the engine.
I suspect high oil temps had something to do with it too, I don't trust the oil cooler is big enough.
Journal bearing failure modes (bloody 300Tdi's...)

Having had various vehicles and machines that had conversions done the last thing I would do is get a conversion done.If I was travelling into the unknown I would stick to a standard Tdi and standard vehicle in general and know the vehicle and carry spares and know how to fit them.If during your trip you have a problem simply contact one of the hundreds of LR suppliers,send you VIN and the correct part will arrive,the last thing you want when in trouble is to be explaining over a bad connection that you have a 96 Tdi with a Isuzu Trooper/ute whatever 2ltre something that has a clutch out of a something else that stuffed etc etc,been there in Oz so stuff that.LR's have been travelling the roads of the world for longer than most of us have been alive and my Tdi has 450,000k's on it so don't tell me they aren't good enough. Pat

Originally Posted by rick130

Arthur, some Tdi's just do big ends.

JC reckons there was a batch, appears to be the last six months of '98 that destroy big ends and cranks.

I had my shells let go and luckily didn't do the crank too and AFAIK no water had ever entered the engine.
I suspect high oil temps had something to do with it too, I don't trust the oil cooler is big enough.
Journal bearing failure modes (bloody 300Tdi's...)

Hi Rick130

Originally Posted by rick130

Here's a couple of pics of a 300Tdi big end shell.
I wish I still had all my references on this, I'm unsure exactly what has precipitated this failure of the overlay, I suspect oil temp although there is no evidence of overheating in the journals, it could also be a vibration fatigue failure or just a poor bearing.
The overlay is lifting/delaminating in microscopically thin flakes ranging in size up to about 6mm across.
I'm sure someone like Dave will chime in soon.


Attached Thumbnails

These pictures have the same markings that we found after both water damaged motors were pulled down and until somebody has a better explaination of how this damaged is caused, I would stick to the idea that it is water which is causing these marks.

Cheers Arthur

Originally Posted by PAT303

Having had various vehicles and machines that had conversions done the last thing I would do is get a conversion done.If I was travelling into the unknown I would stick to a standard Tdi and standard vehicle in general and know the vehicle and carry spares and know how to fit them.If during your trip you have a problem simply contact one of the hundreds of LR suppliers,send you VIN and the correct part will arrive,the last thing you want when in trouble is to be explaining over a bad connection that you have a 96 Tdi with a Isuzu Trooper/ute whatever 2ltre something that has a clutch out of a something else that stuffed etc etc,been there in Oz so stuff that.LR's have been travelling the roads of the world for longer than most of us have been alive and my Tdi has 450,000k's on it so don't tell me they aren't good enough. Pat

Would be interesting to know how many members have over 400k on the their 200/300 tdi donks.

A mate of mine in Melbourne has a '97 110 300tdi with over 400k on it now. His experience and driving his vehicle is partly the reason I changed from a 2004 Nissan Patrol to a '96 130. Naturally I kept the Nissan though to tow the Landy back home. I'm not completely stupid ).

He's replaced the gearbox, or had it reconditioned, replaced a clutch, had a couple of minor things go wrong - and that's it. And he's been tough with that car - towed a 2 tonne caravan around West Oz for a long time. Now he's towing a 1.8 Conquerer camper - he reports it's slow on the hills, otherwise fine.

I've driven with him and he's careful but goes anywhere he wants. The funny thing is his relatively aged 2.5 shunts his 110 along almost exactly the same as my 2004 Patrol with the ZD3.0L, which has done only 140k. Hardly any difference at all.

He asked Ritters recently how long they thought his motor would last and they just shrugged and said there's not much reason for it to stop apart from the bottom end failing, and according to them his bottom is fine, thank you very much.

You don't have to go the full 2.8 route. I have a TDi300 in my range rover. I added a 2.8 manifold and turbo, big front mount intercooler and exhaust. It is a very usable vehicle and a lot cheaper to do.
I enjoy driving it just as much as my P38A and my wife prefers the comfort of the P38A but would rather drive the diesel.

Originally Posted by Hokoman

Would be interesting to know how many members have over 400k on the their 200/300 tdi donks.

A mate of mine in Melbourne has a '97 110 300tdi with over 400k on it now. His experience and driving his vehicle is partly the reason I changed from a 2004 Nissan Patrol to a '96 130. Naturally I kept the Nissan though to tow the Landy back home. I'm not completely stupid ).

He's replaced the gearbox, or had it reconditioned, replaced a clutch, had a couple of minor things go wrong - and that's it. And he's been tough with that car - towed a 2 tonne caravan around West Oz for a long time. Now he's towing a 1.8 Conquerer camper - he reports it's slow on the hills, otherwise fine.

I've driven with him and he's careful but goes anywhere he wants. The funny thing is his relatively aged 2.5 shunts his 110 along almost exactly the same as my 2004 Patrol with the ZD3.0L, which has done only 140k. Hardly any difference at all.

He asked Ritters recently how long they thought his motor would last and they just shrugged and said there's not much reason for it to stop apart from the bottom end failing, and according to them his bottom is fine, thank you very much.

I've owned mine since new and every cold start I let it sit for a minute before driving away and drive steady until the temp gets up and then I drive it harder than most,I like to keep the combustion temp high and don't believe in nana driving.I see no reason why it won't keep going,it fires first time every time and it's been all over Oz from minus degree's in the snow to 45+ in the desert.If looked after,overheating kills them dead,they are a brilliant little engine. Pat

Originally Posted by Hokoman

Would be interesting to know how many members have over 400k on the their 200/300 tdi donks.

Hi Hokoman

Our 300 TDi Auto Discovery, build April,1994, has now got 516,000 Klms on it and is going well.
It still does better than 10ltrs / 100 Klms and doesn't need any oil topups between changes.

The 1996 Defender flat tray, with its 300TDi, has had an issue with the head gasket at about 200,000 Klms, but that was not the vehicles fault ,as I discovered that the wrong length head bolts had been used, proir to me owning this vehicle and they were only holding by about four threads.
It has now done 260,000 Klms and is getting heavy on fuel useage, so when the timing belt is done next, I have some new injectors ready to go in also.

Cheers Arthur

Originally Posted by 51jay

You don't have to go the full 2.8 route. I have a TDi300 in my range rover. I added a 2.8 manifold and turbo, big front mount intercooler and exhaust. It is a very usable vehicle and a lot cheaper to do.
I enjoy driving it just as much as my P38A and my wife prefers the comfort of the P38A but would rather drive the diesel.

That's interesting - I have thought about it but the general opinion seems to be that since the motor has done 270k as a builder's vehicle and carried heavy loads most of it's life it would be wise to pull it down and thoroughly recondition. And that's expensive and for not much more I can have a new 2.8. All depends upon whether it's really necessary to recondition I guess.