Thread: So the 90 broke down again, with a mystery!

Originally Posted by Leroy_Riding

LR did not supply me with the dirt/sand no, they showed me a sample the rest had been disposed of when they flushed the tank.
LR will not talk to me about it unless I am booking it in to have it fixed (talking about the dealership here I have not phoned JLR australia office)

It has only been filled up at service stations never anything else, and has always been caltex service stations except for my trip to MT isa back in January that saw it filled up at whatever servo the town had when I was nearing empty.

they initially said they found dirt/sand in the filter, and then when they dropped diesel from the tank they found it in there also (of which they tell me was an ice cream container worth)

I would be contacting the LR head office. It is common for there to be dirt in a tank. As for dirt in the filter - which side??? See the pictures in the 2nd file I uploaded for how much dirt can be in the fuel.

IMHO (I am an engineer not a lawyer) the onus would be on the dealer/LR to prove that the dirt in the tank was more than should have been there for a vehicle that had covered that many km. If they have thrown away the dirt they cannot do that.

The dealer (and LR) will try and wash their hands of the issue, however my (non-expert) understanding of warranty laws is they cannot do that legally.

Originally Posted by isuzurover

I would be contacting the head office. It is common for there to be dirt in a tank. As for dirt in the filter - which side??? See the pictures in the 2nd file I upoaded for how much dirt can be in the fuel.

IMHO (I am an engineer not a lawyer) the onus would be on the dealer/LR to prove that the dirt in the tank was more than should have been there for a vehicle that had covered that many km. If they have thrown away the dirt they cannot do that.

The dealer (and LR) will try and wash their hands of the issue, however my (non-expert) understanding of warranty laws is they cannot do that.

I will call the dealer again and ask them for an accurate volume and if sand was found on the 'outlet' side of the filter.

then ill call LR australia.

Originally Posted by Leroy_Riding

I will call the dealer again and ask them for an accurate volume and if sand was found on the 'outlet' side of the filter.

then ill call LR australia.

If any "sand" size particles are getting past the filter then that means the filter has failed - which would be Land Rover's problem.

I would record the conversation for your records - and ask them to provide proof of their claims. AFAIK in QLD you are allowed to record conversations you are a party to without the knowledge of the other party...

Email. Everything in writing. If they don't answer in 48 hrs escalate it ad infinitum.

I haven't really considered that, as I haven't really had an issue with this dealer. . . . and I do not believe this is an issue with the dealer. . I don't want to be going and causing trouble with them for no reason.

they are going to call me back tomorrow morning with what they still have or can provide from when they had my car.

Bruce Davis does a water watch fuel filter for LR's.

If you had one fitted by,for e.g. MR auto,(as the OP is in Brisbane)i doubt it would affect warranty.

Look as much as I sympathise with you on that it is an expensive repair it still could be a lot worse. This may come across in some parts as harsh but its straight up truth and logic from a being in the trade point of view.

You really only have 2 options:
Keep the car at home, save up some money and have it fixed when you can afford it.
Or
Sell it as it is and buy something else.

I'd be very surprised if the dealer still has any of the sand.
I personally keep samples for MAX 3-4 days. My attitude being: if you wanted a sample you should of asked for one at the time of being told what the diagnosis was. I am NOT a storage depo and neither is my work bench. I come to work to diagnose cars faults, fix them when authorised and that's it. You don't expect a plumber to keep burst pipes so why expect me to.

If they have kept a sample, WTF are you going to do with it?? Send it to a lab and then what?!
"Yes mr......... We have tested the sample you have provided and can confirm for you that it contains, some limestone, some sulphuric rock and some common dirt which is predominate found in such and such a place. You bill for testing will in the post". Seriously wot are you going to achieve by knowing the type of sand it is?

Thinking the route of well it should of got past the filter the filter isn't fit for purpose really is a no brainer. The filter was never intended for sand. It's designed for SMALL particles that end up in a fuel tank, the odd bit of dust and some water. NOT a huge amount of anything you fancy putting in the tank.
For the law people it there I can tell you LR reply before you even ask them
LR "do you take the vehicle off road sir"
You "well yes of course it's a defender"
LR " do you have the servicing done according to the arduous service schedule"
You "erm no? The dealer carries put my services as per normal"
LR "sorry sir but the normal routine services are for mostly road use vehicles"

Aka if you go offroad a lot things need to be changed more regularly. Hence the Arduous service schedules. You honestly don't expect an air filter to last as long on an offroad vehicle as it will n a city going defender do you? No different for any filter.

Those of you that are reading this post and are worried.....it's very very simple. You don't need to add extra filters, gizmos and gadgets. Just change you fuel filter more often.

And finally in regards to "if sands got past the fuel filter its land rover problem"
Actually no it's not at all. It's YOUR problem.
Its down to YOU to prove the filter faulty not them to prove its not.
The simple fact that the filter isn't designed to stop sand that shouldn't be in the fuel tank to start is clear cut removal of any blame towards LR.
If the filter blocks up to extent it has then obviously there is a chance that the suction from the high pressure pump will cause the filter to break down.
But like ive already said its not down to LR to prove they aren't to blame its down to you to prove that they are which unless you have a serious amount of money to waste on trials and tests across a broad range of several filters good luck with that thought.

Leyroy obviously my whole post is not aimed at you, it's obvious you know what the score is but if I don't say what I've now said the thread will just fill up with more people thinking that you have a chance at getting LR to pay which you simply do not.
MAYBE. They will pay some towards your costs as a goodwill gesture but that's down to them to decide. Good luck with it

Originally Posted by JamesB71

Email. Everything in writing.

+1

Recording conversations without consent is tricky ground, and if you tell them you are / plan to record the conversation it will usually only serve to annoy / put the other party on the defensive.

For verbal conversations I suggest a follow up email outlining the nature of the conversation (who, what, when, where, how) and the outcome / actions, and ask the other person to confirm by return email within a specified time frame that they either agree or disagree with what you have written.