Cylinder sleeve failure or something else?

**Andrew D** · 30th April 2019, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by biggin

Does this look like a sleeve that has slipped, because after looking at this very closely, it looks exactly the same as the good ones.

You need to pressure test the lower block. Then you will have the answer. I suspect the bore has cracked.

I didn't have any noise, just a minor amount of moisture in the cylinder that eventually became a large amount.

**PhilipA** · 30th April 2019, 08:39 PM

Look at the top of the block near the threaded hole at bottom right.
See the stain that is nowhere else?
IMHO it could be caused by water moving between the gasket and sleeve.
That is the usual place they crack.

Regards Philip A

**101RRS** · 30th April 2019, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by biggin

Originally Posted by 101RRS

- evidence of "steam cleaning" where coolant has come up the outside of the liner (your pic shows a possible small gap between liner block at the top of the pic but is hard to see.

Looking at your pic again - the subject piston top looks pretty clean with only a bit of carbon yet the one to the right is pretty covered in carbon when they should all look pretty much the same - on looking at your pic again the subject piston looks like it has been steam cleaned - a clear symptom of a slipped liner.

Garry

**Pedro_The_Swift** · 1st May 2019, 05:48 AM

whats all the gunge on the gasket near the firewall?

**Andrew D** · 1st May 2019, 11:17 AM

YouTube

In the event you haven't seen this video during "what the "f' do I do now" phase of life with a Land Rover

Also this which is good for reference.

YouTube

I'd imagine other people would be more interested.

Top hatting maybe a waste of money.

**biggin** · 1st May 2019, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by Pedro_The_Swift

whats all the gunge on the gasket near the firewall?

I think it was oil spilling from the end headbolt hole when I removed the head.

**biggin** · 1st May 2019, 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by Andrew D

YouTube

In the event you haven't seen this video during "what the "f' do I do now" phase of life with a Land Rover

Also this which is good for reference.

YouTube

I'd imagine other people would be more interested.

Top hatting maybe a waste of money.

Ah ha, good on you Andrew. Finally the RPI video answers the problems I had understanding how new liners would stop the coolant leak.
The answer is, it won’t!
So, in short, a block with coolant leaks behind the liner are U/S.
Only a block with slipped liners but no coolant leaks can be refurbished with new top hat liners.
Not a good outcome but I’m happy that I finally have my head around this issue.

**ozscott** · 1st May 2019, 03:22 PM

It is interesting how off centre the casts became. The machining marks per the video shown with the fighter planes evidence that...see the screenshot below and watch the vid for explanation. Deep castings near pushrods on one side and none at all on the other...so you can see how water jacket castings were so out of tolerance. Then see a photo of the valley from my motor which is a mid 90's 4.6...No such issues so it seems they went south after that. Cheers

**rover-56** · 1st May 2019, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by biggin

Ah ha, good on you Andrew. Finally the RPI video answers the problems I had understanding how new liners would stop the coolant leak.
The answer is, it won’t!
So, in short, a block with coolant leaks behind the liner are U/S.
Only a block with slipped liners but no coolant leaks can be refurbished with new top hat liners.
Not a good outcome but I’m happy that I finally have my head around this issue.

May be worth considering vacuum impregnation in addition to new liners, top hat or plain, or pinned.
My 4.6 was rebuilt with pinned liners and vacuum impregnated by the previous owner 180k km ago and seems ok still. Existing liners were used, honed and new rings fitted.
Vacuum impregnation was common when I was an apprentice with a machine tool manufacturer back in the '60s. they used a resin compound to seal porous castings which had hydraulic oil reservoirs.
These days a Loctite compound is used.
I have the name of the company who did the job if interested.
Terry

**AK83** · 2nd May 2019, 04:04 AM

Originally Posted by biggin

....
What would be a ball park figure for re-sleeving using my block?

I have a D2 V8 that I'm slowly .. no!.. very slowly getting back on the road with motor issues too.
I suspected a slipped liner/cracked block, but in the mean time I checked cooling system and found many great wonders and anomalies on the 'work' that previous repairers had tried on the cooling system.
Blocked coolant pathways, diversions, etc. Then pulled the radiator and found it 99.99% blocked up with crud too.
Fitted new rad, test drove car a little, ran OK, so booked in to get a RWC inspection. On the way it heated up about 40mins into the drive and cooked the motor(oops .. pushed it a bit over the dge I guess).

But it only confirmed what I knew anyhow .. that the block had a crack that caused the original overheating .. hence the bodge job previous attempts to bypass the underlying issue.
So the motor is scrap, and my V8 killing effort to get to the RWC inspection was probably for the best for this particular engine anyhow!

About 12 months ago, I located a recommended shop to do the heads and got a couple of prices from them(here in Melbourne).
$650 for the heads alone, and another $1100 to also do the top hat liner on the block.
Didn't think to ask if the $1100 for the block was good just for the block alone, or if that price was because I'd get the heads done there too .. but as a ballpark figure that's what I was quoted.

Note I didn't specifically ask if this $1100 was for supplied and fitted liners, or just the cost of the engineering(ie. that I'd have to supply liners). I just assumed back then that his quote was all inclusive(he would supply liners).

ps. have another motor going to go into this car ... just need the time to do it.

hopefully soon.

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