130 Crew Cab Defender

Hmmm, I drive a 130 Crew Cab and a GU Patrol ute on a daily basis, often getting out of one and jumping into the other.
I'm 187cm/6'2" tall, mostly legs and have raised the drivers seat 22mm.
I jumped out of the 'fender yesterday after a five hour drive feeling fine, including keeping in front of a briskly driven Forrester on the Putty Road. In fact, there aren't too many vehicles keep up with me on the twisty bits, but thats another story. ;-)
When doing the same miles in the Patrol, I climb out with a numb arse, sore left knee, and I continually bang my elbow on the centre console when changing gears.

Yep, the 'fender is noisy, leaky, draughty and I don't intend to change it.

As to the chassis cracking, they all seem prone to it. Apart from the chassis bracket that holds the small transverse body cross member at the rear of the cab which tends to crack off down the chassis rail, both rear rails tend to let go right where the forward facing brace for the 'A' frame cross member finishes at the chassis rail. I've just noticed mine letting go there. (167,000km) Looks like a tray off and plate job.
I've been keeping an eye out for it as I've noticed a few others cracked there. They are noted for doing it in the Territory (which is where mine originates)

Patrols also crack the rear of their chassis' (leaf sprung ones at the hangers, coil ones go behind the rear axle) TLC's crack chassis and front axle housings (as do Landy's), and the Telstra guy's totally kill their little Mazda Bravos, including, but not limited to, shock absorbers (sheared shafts and eyes and blown seals), clutches, brakes, chassis, diffs, etc.
Nissan have been great with their Telstra vehicles and really work hard at overcoming/re-engineering problems, much like Land Rover used to do in the JRA days. Shame PAG/Ford really don't give a toss.

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Originally posted by Sith
When the Pom's do more with their sales team and vehicl comfort v's cargo space .... well i think they will get a lot more custom :wink:

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Isn't that what the Disco and Freelander are for? ;-)

Either way, enjoy your Patrol :-)

Glad you found a vehicle. My wife bought mine just before I bought it. She couldn't see what everyone was complaining about. Only complaint since is climbing up into it. We need to get side steps instead of the rock sliders.

Compring a Pootrol to a Defender is like ..

comparing Michael Jackson to Charles Bronson .. [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img]

:wink:

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Originally posted by George130
We need to get side steps instead of the rock sliders.

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There has to be an engineered solution to this. A small "obstackle" to overcome.

(I love my primative Disco though.)

It was sujested I take the bottom skirts (The bit below the doors) off. I am now thinking that the way to go is push the sliders out past the body and build water tanks to fill the space between the chassis ond the sliders and then put chequer plate on the top of the sliders. Bingo side steps with water tanks and still have the protection.
Now just need to design and cost it.

What we plan to do on my Def. 110 is to replace the sills with rock-sliders but have a piece of tubular sticking out the side as well. Then shove some checkerplate over the top and walla, rocksliders with side-steps.

Similar to what George130 was talking about.

I think what you have to realise about the Defender, is that you are looking at a design whose basics were set as a working vehicle in 1947 with some revisions in dimensions up to 1958. But if anything, the available space has decreased since then with thicker doors and more gearbox protrusion into the floor. (plus extras like aircon, radios, etc etc)

Since this design was frozen two major changes have taken place - possibly the most important is that people everywhere have got substantially bigger - my father (b1903) at 6ft was taller than almost anyone in his generation - today he woould only look average. I would guess most if not all of those involved in the Landrover design were smaller than him. And after the depression and six years of war, none of them were fat, or even comfortable by todays standards. But another is that standards of comfort for workers have increased, and Landrovers are no longer (and probably never were entirely) driven only by workers. In fact, it is likely that in the last twenty years the majority even of Defender drivers do so from choice rather than that they need to for work. Air conditioning was not even envisaged as a fitting for luxury cars in 1947, let alone working vehicles, and there is simply no room for it to fit easily. These are the drawbacks of the design.

On the other hand, look at the advantages (and I am talking about the overall design, not details - these vary with the model):-
The meccano like construction means that almost all repairs can be carried out without elaborate equipment to get the vehicle apart (for example all parts except the engine can be lifted by two men and most by one), and that panel repair by replacement, for example can be done largely with a set of spanners not welding gear.

Compared to virtually any other comparable vehicle, the Defender has near vertical glass all round. This means that when standing out in the sun - and how much of this happens? - the heat gain is less, in some cases MUCH less. OK, so you have good airconditioning - but you still have to stand out in the sun while you reach into the oven to start the engine and wait for it to cool down! (Looking at the greenhouse design of virtually every car in the world, it is obvious that almost all designers live in cold climates - and the ones that don't, follow the mob). And with the Defender you can leave the vents wide open to allow the breeze (if any) to get in without compromising security and with little risk of rain getting in.

The alloy body panels mean that you don't have to worry about every chip or scratch in the paint.

These advantages without even looking at off road capability - and the Defender is at least as capable as anything else, much more so than most, with better ground clearance, approach & departure angles and suspension travel. These go together with reasonable ride and handling on road. The alloy and relatively flimsy body make the centre of gravity lower, and hence safer on and off road.

Sure, I could get something that was more comfortable (except for the point about the heat buildup), more modern looks, probably better finished (but what is better finish in a working vehicle?), possibly more reliable, certainly with a better dealer network and support - but I don't think I can get anything else that I could do the 18km of rocks, gullies, sand, mud (if it ever rains again), roos etc to the bitumen at 60-80kph year in and year out with complete confidence that nothing is going to break that I have at present (so far the worst that I've done is wreck a near new tyre on a slab of rock, and got hit by a roo - just behind the back wheel!).

Could the Defender be improved if were designed from a clean sheet? certainly - but how much would be lost? For a start, I'll bet the first thing it would get would be a steeply raked greenhouse windscreen that not only greatly increases the heat buildup, but costs a fortune to replace. Also lost would be the ability to source a lot of bits from the graveyard under the tree out the back!

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Originally posted by Sith
thanks Ace , i was more than a little disapointed with the Defender and sales team :roll: comfort shouldn't be an issue :wink: after all it is the year 2005 :roll: :roll: not 1965
Yeah the 4.2 td will be a bit thurstier than the 300td , but unlike the 300 it doesn't need timing belts every 80,000 and has a total track record along with the drive train of being bullet proof :D 8)
No electrical drama's ... unlike Lucas 8O aircond works a treat .... and comfortable passengers [wife and kids ]both in leg rom and air cond makes for happier miles traveling :D :D
Plenty of room , no drama's with mechanic's or leaks , parts everywhere , LSD in the rear , so iam rather wrapped .....
When the Pom's do more with their sales team and vehicl comfort v's cargo space .... well i think they will get a lot more custom :wink:

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[img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] I like the bit about the bullet proof drive train!! [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img]

Sounds like you got all your info on Land Rovers from the bloody Nissan dealer you clown.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>I like the bit about the bullet proof drive train!!
Sounds like you got all your info on Land Rovers from the bloody Nissan dealer you clown.

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They are bullet proof compared to L/R !
the Nissan g/box, swivel housings, unis, drive shafts and especially the diffs (excepting a Sals) and CV's crap all over Rover bits. The dodgy 5th gear in early GU's was overcome pretty quickly. The only decent driveline component Land Rover have is the LT230 t/case, and then they had to screw it up with the coarse splines on the input shaft !!