130 Crew Cab Defender

Quote:

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Originally posted by rick130
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>The fact remains that you dont brake things unless you are doing something stupid,

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Hands up those who have a disc rear 110/130 with more than 70 000km on the clock that haven't flogged out the stock rear drive flanges and axles ??

Won't be too many.

How many have a bent track rod ?

Put a locker in the front axle and you will snap the 32 spline CV's, not maybe, will.

How many 130CC's with more than 100 000km are running around without cracked chassis ?

......oh hell.....
I tried not to respond......

:cry: no more from me on this thread.[/b][/quote]

Ok, i am not one to enter in to petty bickering, but i couldnt help myself.

Stuff wears out, even quicker when you flog the crap out of it (I said being sensible), things do brake, but when you are being sensible brakages are uncommon. To break a track rod, you would need to be pushing hard, back off and re assess the situation, applying more loud pedal is a recipe for disaster.

Lockers arent "leaving things standard" (as i think i said), and when a diff is locked solid, there isnt the slip which is provided by an unlocked diff, so something gives when to much pressure is applied.

If you think Land Rovers are so **** weak bugger off and buy a damn nissan, i have been told they are unbreakable. Or if you want to be certain buy a Hilux, the adds even say they are unbreakable. :roll:

Broonski, thanks mate, its good to know some people have common sense and know how to read. Matt

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>If you think Land Rovers are so **** weak bugger off and buy a damn nissan, i have been told they are unbreakable. Or if you want to be certain buy a Hilux, the adds even say they are unbreakable[/b][/quote]
Oh well, said I wasn't going to post again...

Matt, I actually do have a Nissan. Over the last fifteen years we have had an MQ, then a GQ, and now a GU so I can compare very easily.
Also had Jeeps of various descriptions in the past, and now a Defender 130 Crew Cab for the last four years.

I can't help but be realistic about the vehicles I drive, both good and bad points. To those that haven't flogged out late model (ie greased hub) drive flanges consider yourselves very lucky. I've experienced it, and many I know have. A few have been left stranded, one friend on the edge of the Simpson. It happens. It is a bad design. Convert to oil lubed hubs by using a RTC3511 seal, pull out the inner axle seal and problem solved, but it shouldn't have to be like this.
Cracked chasssis are common. Mines cracked, my step-fathers is cracked, and every 130 that was used by the BFC in the Territory cracked.
If you read my earlier (first ?) post on this thread, I also mention that Nissan chassis' crack and where.
I've seen a number of bent track rods. (including mine) They are too small a diameter for a rod in compression. Have a look at a Maxi Drive track rod, then a late model GU Patrol. There is a reason why they are much larger than an OE L/R item.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>The fact remains that you dont brake things unless you are doing something stupid,[/b][/quote]
The things I've recounted happen through 'normal' usage, ie, normal day to day work vehicles. These aren't weekend warrior vehicles, but are used as work vehicles.

Sheesh fella's you are starting to sound like a bunch of Toyota owners "my cars the best/doesn't break down", etc, etc.
In my experience, Land Rover are flawed in a number of rectifiable areas, and yes I work mine hard on a daily basis and IMHO it should take it.
Do I want to get rid of it ?
No, as it does things that the Nissan can't do, in the areas I use it, and it pleases me more to drive. I'm not blind to its faults, and in a number of areas, including the driveline, a Patrol is (a lot) stronger. This is where I originally took exception to D110V8 little dig at Sith.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'> Southern Landrover and had a look around , whilst waiting for a salesman strolled around and had a chat with a couple of the mechanics , very nice guys , very honest they said that it would be in my and my bank accounts best interest to leave the yard before the sales man was free ..... they said anything with a green badge is trouble
So the salesman came along and gave us a LR to test drive , and dismissed the mechanics quotes , saying they are just biased ????? [/b][/quote]
I find it odd that a mechanic working for a land Rover dealer would make such a statement. All vehicles have their shortcomings and their lemons. Mechanically I have not been able to fault any of the Rovers I have owned and they are the most capable 4wds I have ever owned or driven. The only real let down is the comfort levels in the Defender, which with minimal redesign could be addressed quite easily. I am in the process of lifting the seats by about 45mm. The test bar went in yesterday and the wife was quite impressed with the leg room difference. In the future I may look at air con alternatives and the possibility of getting the door trims narrowed. You only need 1-1 1/2 inches of room to stop the door trim being annoying. I can live with the hand brake. Heaters and decent aircon for the kids in the back are a must though.
Hope you like the Nissan though. It is a shame you did not look at a Disco or a Rangie.

Guys,
The original post was just asking for comments regarding a Defender, not for a slanging match. Both positive and negative comments are good as it will give the person an informed choice. I love my Rovers but the Defender has some major design issues, which in reality (and this might upset the purists) is not acceptable in 2005 in any vehicle especially one at around $50k. Most of it is minor and just damn annoying. There is plenty of room to make a better fit for the air con and rear colling / heating. It was actually my missus who picked out the Fender and it IS A GREAT 4WD.
The purists argue that it should be left as is, if this is the case by a series and restore it, but with a few basic modifications, not high tec upgrades the Fender could be a top seller.
My Fender has clocked up 105,000kms and has had no rear end dramas.
The GU drive train is not bullet proof and Nissan actually downgraded the drive lines in the late 80's. The old MQ/MK patrols did have bullet proof drive lines as they were Nissan Truck items. The change was made to target a softer market that did not want loud diffs or gearboxes.
I do love my Fender but after 8 hours driving the right knee is mighty uncomfortable.

i totally agree with you both [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img]

i was talking to a mate the other about this same kind of topic

why on earth would somebody spend $50,000 for a car that is very limited in driver features

when at the same price range of other makes they come with alot more features and are a more comfy car

note i ride comfort though :wink:


i also had 2 defenders which i bought brand new
my 130 and a 110 extreme

that extreme we had was the biggest pile of crap ever bought :evil: :evil:

so i do know the in and outs of these cars

but my 130 is still going strong and wouldn't part with it

once you get used to the rawness of them [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img] [img]style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif[/img]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>I do love my Fender but after 8 hours driving the right knee is mighty uncomfortable[/b][/quote]

it's a personal thing, isn't it. I jump out of the 'fender after 5-5.5 hours as fresh as I got in, (seat raised 22mm) yet I can barely walk after getting out of the Patrol driving the same distance and roads. It's the left knee that gives me grief in it. The much more upright position in the 'fender means that my left knee is in a relatively straight plane, wheras in the Patrol it's cranked over to the left severely. Oh, and I nearly always smash my knees getting in and out of the Patrol, and don't start me on how unsupportive standard Patrol seats are...... :wink:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>but my 130 is still going strong and wouldn't part with it

once you get used to the rawness of them [/b][/quote]

same here. At least I went into Defender ownership with my eyes wide open. As I said earlier, one of my mates was an engineer at JRA (he did the 6x6 transmission) and then later on a consulting engineer for LRA just prior to the Ford takeover, so I had a pretty good grounding in their foibles (like the undersized track rod) and features.

It has so much character that the Patrol can't match, although it does give SWMBO a little too much ammo in the ongoing household car war.
Guess where one of the "Anything else is just crap" stickers will end up, and how long do you reckon she'll take to find it. :twisted:

when she does find it 8O 8O 8O 8O


run for cover mate :wink: :wink:

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'>JRA (he did the 6x6 transmission)[/b][/quote]
MMMM a 6x6 fender/110/Perentie whatever. Now that would be nice. Nice large tray, custom tradesmans hutch to acomodate fridge/freezers, bags etc, a nice roller drawer under the tray and room on top for the kids quad and a couple of dirt bikes, not to mention the off road capability. I could forgo the comforts for that.
Do I have to wake up, Mum. I want to keep dreaming.

If the drivers side door panel was flat instead of raised the right leg would not be an issue. This is the annoying part as my knee seems to sit right on the ridge. Maybe the seat lift will alleviate this, will have to wait and see.

Next issue is getting an alarm, I think I may be installing one myself along with central locking. Got a quote that was not bad and just wanted to make sure that they had worked on Rovers before, quote changed from a fixed price mobile service to an hourly rate workshop job. No confidence in their own ability. I have found the Fender easy to work on and access areas with the mob that quoted saying they are more difficult and require more time, the central locking would need a new harness as it is a hinged door. I think that is utter crap and they just dont want the job as they have no idea about LR and bad word of mouth has gotten around.
On a better note had the windows tinted and the guy did a great job, can not even see any edge gaps at all and they basically did it for free as my missus bought the voucher at a charity auction. I was expecting them to charge me more because of the size but did the lot with a smile. Slipped the workshop a carton though as we got the voucher cheap and they spent a good 6 hours on it. For information it was Instant Windscreens.

The features issue is what put me off most of the vehicles I was looking at when I began looking for a vehicle. I wasn't happy paying the prices for a dual cab with no comfort features. Dealers also petrified of me converting to LPG. They all said the same we can give you a contact to do the conversion but we won't convert it for you and your waranty is void if you do. Then I found my 130. Couldn't be happier.

Hi Rick, I agree, Land Rover have a few areas that need to be modified, and yes these mods would be easily done. Why they dont bother to make the changes, only Land Rover engineers will ever know. Lets hope they rectify the most obvious problems, mainly ergonomics, with next years revised defender.

I am not at all saying my car never breaks down, i am just saying with some common sense breakages can be severely reduced, and most breakages can be avoided as they occur when people are doing something silly. Bugger drive flanges would be more wear and tear than anything else. I do agree that track rods should be a bigger diameter, however i fail to see how day to day work would bend one, I have seen defenders, and Discos do some serious stuff off road, not 130's, and they havent even looked like bending. I bent the one on my disco, but i hit a stump, and it was my fault, i should have been paying more attention to where i was going. But lets save the petty bickering and just agree to disagree. Matt