Dislocate or Retain?

**BigJon** · 5th June 2010, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by Tusker

P.S.

Wombat holes in Appin, as an example

Regards
Max P

Great front end flex there, I really should do something to make my Rangie flex like that. Tennis balls in the rear springs certainly have helped (stiffer rear forcing front to work).

**clean32** · 5th June 2010, 02:05 PM

Following from what Dougal posted, dislocating springs don’t at first glance seem to have much weight on them. IE the wheel may be on the ground but only held there by the weight of the wheel its self. With no load on the wheel wouldn’t it just spin with no traction, or am I wrong?

**awabbit6** · 5th June 2010, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by clean32

Following from what Dougal posted, dislocating springs don’t at first glance seem to have much weight on them. IE the wheel may be on the ground but only held there by the weight of the wheel its self. With no load on the wheel wouldn’t it just spin with no traction, or am I wrong?

The wheel will still have some traction. The wheel and axle have mass so will apply some force (weight) down on the ground.

As well as the mass of the lower wheel, there is a force applied by the higher wheel. The spring on the high side will act as a fulcrum and as the high wheel is pushed up, the lower wheel is pushed down with a force proportional to the ratio of the distances from each end of the axle to the spring.

**Dougal** · 5th June 2010, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by awabbit6

The wheel will still have some traction. The wheel and axle have mass so will apply some force (weight) down on the ground.

As well as the mass of the lower wheel, there is a force applied by the higher wheel. The spring on the high side will act as a fulcrum and as the high wheel is pushed up, the lower wheel is pushed down with a force proportional to the ratio of the distances from each end of the axle to the spring.

And reducing that downforce is the binding off all the suspension bushings.

What's the net result? 50kg?

**Psimpson7** · 5th June 2010, 03:26 PM

I agree its low, but still better than nothing most likely.

**awabbit6** · 5th June 2010, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by Dougal

And reducing that downforce is the binding off all the suspension bushings.

What's the net result? 50kg?

Not much, but more than a wheel in the air.

**PAT303** · 5th June 2010, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by BigJon

Great front end flex there, I really should do something to make my Rangie flex like that. Tennis balls in the rear springs certainly have helped (stiffer rear forcing front to work).

My mates stock RRC's have done the wombat holes dozens of times,whats different about yours?. Pat

**BigJon** · 5th June 2010, 04:59 PM

I think the aftermarket springs of unknown origin are a bit firm in the front. It handles very well on the bitumen though and I am a bit wary of introducing massive body roll.

**frantic** · 5th June 2010, 05:53 PM

Heres an option, Wish i had the $$$$$

X-eng High Performance Off-Road Engineering

Go here and have a look at the x-spring, pure brilliance!!!!
With this you not only get the drop of a dislocating spring but also much more weight pushing down on the lower wheel so in a DRY place like Oz much more forward momentum! To think this up in the land of green lanes, rain 'n' peat bogs is amazing!
They look about 900+ (exchange rate varies)over here with the extra $$ going to get a very long travel shock !

**lambrover** · 5th June 2010, 06:02 PM

I love this subject, I have a county with a 2 inch lift but I have made custome shock towers so I can run long travel shocks, I run my coils unretained. My mate has a defender with a 2 inch Old Man Emu lift and he use to run retained coils. He would pick up wheels much easier and than the car is balancing on three wheels to me this is a stage of being unstable, on the other hand my vehicle was the same height but mine will sit flat over wombat holes and wash outs, I think it's more than just dislocating coils, you still have to have the right coil to get the best out of it. lots of people sacrifice there up travel to gain a lift but this is the incorrect way to do suspension.

some are arguing that it's better to retain, I ask how as even the weight of an axle and the fulcrum effect from the suspension geometory if that wheel is on the ground and aiding in traction that has to be better than a set up that has a wheel in the air.

another car, a mate has a 130 double locked standard height, my car at this stage had no lockers, my vehicle was much more capable purely because I was keeping the wheels on the ground and he couldn't keep them on the ground and lost traction even with lockers he couldn't follow.

in a defender you don't need the big lifts the jap trucks run so not sure how much the anti squat/roll comes into play and when you get the big flex from the dislocating coils you are not really worried about on road handling as you are going slow when flexed that hard once yu finished playing the car returns to a comfortable height. just my two cents worth

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