Thread: Dislocation or Retention?

Originally Posted by Blknight.aus

experience..

yeah that was the tech I was looking for.........

sorry.

ok on a more serious note.

one of my primary reasons for going dislocation over retention is it allows for more droop and better flexing of the axle. In some setups you might want to retain the spring and use it as a method of checking excessive movement but generally as the axle begins to make serious downward movement retaining the springs on both ends (especially the on the front) can lead to the spring rubbing on other components (like the chassis or the shocky on the front)as it stretches. The other factor that weighs in heavily against locating the spring on both ends is that as the axle droops the mounting plates change angles relative to each other, fixing the spring at both ends can limit this and in extreme cases can place unusual twisting force on the coil of the spring that can deform the mounting point or wear at the spring forming a weak point that can snap.

a few points....If using the stock links in the front, by their nature they will bind and be the limit. That is, you can get the right spring length/rate that will allow droop and bump (retained so as to have that little bit of spring stretch) Using 2 inch fox/king/bilstein etc 12 inch travel shocks, the limit of front end flex, will only have slight shock rubbing (these are large dia shocks) springs have not been noted as rubbing chassis... retainers can be set up with a small gap at spring as to allow for the twist that is inherint with extention and retention. While the rear link set up can yeild more travel (14inch shock travel) to get it to do so generally requires soft spring rates and dislocation (not a bad thing)......but how does this effect the front to rear ratio??? the front has more roll stiffness than the rear, and is less flexy by design. Having the front set up as soft as is comfortable and having the rear balanced to the front will get the cross axle system working well. Having the rear really soft and super flexy generally has it travel untill almost its limit before the front starts to work....a common sight is impressive rear wheel flex with the front axle being parrallel with the body..

It is my personal opinion that if using stock links that a maxing out the front and balancing the rear is a good way to go...

Any muppet can put 14 inch shocks in the rear of a rover with eBay mounts and dislocation cones
Usually the same crew that has NO flex in the front end
Meh....... I'm trying to mount a swaybar (properly) in the rear to help balance/force the front end to flex RELATIVE to the rear

The web seems full of coil sprung rovers with rear ends Maxing out 14inch shocks but the front end is barely flexed ??????
Dc

Originally Posted by modman

Any muppet can put 14 inch shocks in the rear of a rover with eBay mounts and dislocation cones
Usually the same crew that has NO flex in the front end
Meh....... I'm trying to mount a swaybar (properly) in the rear to help balance/force the front end to flex RELATIVE to the rear

The web seems full of coil sprung rovers with rear ends Maxing out 14inch shocks but the front end is barely flexed ??????
Dc

how much flex are you getting in the front end? what are your front and rear spring rates?

front 10 inck 80s toy ridepros, skinny arms holey bushes, 20mm turrett spacer, spring king 50 mm lift, the rate is first level above standard

rear is standard koni, cranked standard bush king 50mm lift spring recommended for 110 tray.
rubber bushes throughout

all three brakelines are braided (longer)

when i enter the valley of the travel ramp and drive foward (up) i end with 1 inch of bumpstop clearance at oposing corners. has a smooth transition of front/rear flex.

110 200tdi, was a cab chassis, now a wagon
i find this setup climbs well and when negotiating steep declines if a wheel drops into a rut/hole the ass end dosent want to overtake me (from above)

am collecting parts like rr eas front housing to use with eshock bilsteins
taper ground progressive front springs, new turrets
building rear mounts or maybe buy gwn lewis/d44/generic ebay challenge mounts, rear swaybar set up using cheap ass standard set up

balaclava and gun to rob bank..........

unfortunately these days i seem to have more fun building 'stuff' than wheeling it. like the 10 sets of 20mnv6 40/10 cranked rear links i started 12 months ago
barely enough time to rub the tinea these days
DC

Originally Posted by modman

barely enough time to rub the tinea these days
DC

Did you get that from an association with Betty Swollocks?

Balancing the rear suspension to the front is all well and good, but with the flex of RAs being very limited, 2 times nothing is still nothing
Seriously though,after some geometric doodling. If you drilled all the rubber in the RA bushings so that their bolt sleeves could touch the outer shell of the bush during articulation, the maximum angular axle displacement relative to the chassis of the front axle would be 20 degrees,which translates to around 20'' of wheel travel, measured at the wheel track of 58.5''.
I guess that's not too bad, as the 20 degree axle displacement is fairly close to what the rear suspension gives, which is limited to 22 degrees by the angular limit of the A frame ball joint. But then you would have to allow dislocation at the rear to get the 22 degrees rear axle displacement.
Bill.

The bollocks are fine thanks bill
It's more the steel caps in 35 degree heat if you get the drift

(took me 5 min in google to work out Betty swollocks)

When I get the other front housing in I'll put the skinny arms back in with misalignment spacers and holey bushes. Might make a difference ??

What do you think of a rear swaybar install?
Dc