Thread: 2010 2.4l 110 Puma Deefa:Front Diff Gone Bang in the Night

Originally Posted by 29dinosaur

You're probably very correct... It's inexusable for Land Rover to put the rubbish they do, into a vehicle designed for 4wding though.....

Have to put my 2 bobs worth in, I think . Sounds like you may have a lifetime subscription to a certain 4WD active mag, with " give it the berries" old mate, giving great advice to impressionable young men . If you think any of the vehicles on their DVD's are stock standard, I have a block of flats in Tassie., just for you. Every Land Rover, stock standard , will take you where you want to go, if you have common sense. Want to do extreme stuff, so you can say to your mates mine is bigger than yours? That's why there is an aftermarket industry, [ an industry paying big bucks to " give it the berries" & his mates, to convince young bucks to spend their bucks on mods., they probably don't need.] Un-modified Land Rovers have taken drivers to all the four corners of the World, as opposed to the nearest " impossible " track. I think you should sell your Land Rover to someone who would appreciate it, [ for a very low price, given your opinion of it] and spend all your hard earned on some 'unbreakable' Japanese product, Cheers, Bob

Have a great day! A happy near sixty year old. And I'm looking forward to my next Landy trip very soon with my Landy mates.

I installed an Ashcroft ATB a few weeks ago. Its not difficult if you don't need to touch the pinion. Follow the directions available in the doc available on Ashcroft's site for setting c/w and pinion backlash. Pretty straight forward.

Ive found that it has improved front end grip, turn-in and handling noticeably for the better. Aside from these improvements to how the deefer drives, you wouldn't know it was there. No bad manners at all, but I might find the front tyres wear s little quicker because I'm hitting the corners harder...

Yet to try it offroad but expecting good things all while being nice to cvs and shafts

I have seen Tractor diff's, Toyota diffs, Nissan Patrol Diffs and Land Rover diff's all break.

What was in common with all those failures?

All of them were front diff's that were being used with their vehicles in reverse, with lots of revs and the drivers snatching for traction.

If an inexperienced 4x4 driver needs to back up in a poor traction situation, it is too easy to overdo it and have the front wheels spin and grip, leading to a failure.

My advise is go easy with the revs and that front diff, even one fitted in a fully loaded 130, will last years without any problems.
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Can't say that I remember doing any of what you say here to my defender. Thanks for your input.

Originally Posted by bob10

Have to put my 2 bobs worth in, I think . Sounds like you may have a lifetime subscription to a certain 4WD active mag, with " give it the berries" old mate, giving great advice to impressionable young men . If you think any of the vehicles on their DVD's are stock standard, I have a block of flats in Tassie., just for you. Every Land Rover, stock standard , will take you where you want to go, if you have common sense. Want to do extreme stuff, so you can say to your mates mine is bigger than yours? That's why there is an aftermarket industry, [ an industry paying big bucks to " give it the berries" & his mates, to convince young bucks to spend their bucks on mods., they probably don't need.] Un-modified Land Rovers have taken drivers to all the four corners of the World, as opposed to the nearest " impossible " track. I think you should sell your Land Rover to someone who would appreciate it, [ for a very low price, given your opinion of it] and spend all your hard earned on some 'unbreakable' Japanese product, Cheers, Bob

29 dinosaur, Ignore the uninformed blather in the couple of posts above...

The bottom line is that the rover 2-pin (single cross shaft) diff centre design is the weakest of all comparable 4x4s on the market, and has not been improved since 1948. In fact it was made weaker in ~1971 when LR switched from split-pin cross shaft retainment to circlips - the latter allowed the single cross shaft to rotate and oval the hole it sits in, wearing away the circlips in the process.

It is an inherently weak design, which everyone is strongly advised to upgrade to an LSD or similar - especially if they travel to remote areas.

Originally Posted by isuzurover

29 dinosaur, Ignore the uninformed blather in the couple of posts above...

The bottom line is that the rover 2-pin (single cross shaft) diff centre design is the weakest of all comparable 4x4s on the market, and has not been improved since 1948. In fact it was made weaker in ~1971 when LR switched from split-pin cross shaft retainment to circlips - the latter allowed the single cross shaft to rotate and oval the hole it sits in, wearing away the circlips in the process.

It is an inherently weak design, which everyone is strongly advised to upgrade to an LSD or similar - especially if they travel to remote areas.

Too right.

Not only does the Ashcroft ATB (or another LSD or locker) overcome the weakness with the cross pin in a rover two pinion diff, the replacement carriers flex less, providing better support to the crown wheel, which is a considerable benefit.

Ashcroft ATB, or tru-trac, combined with traction control is a formidable combination off road - and either benefit from the other being there.

Originally Posted by isuzurover

The bottom line is that the rover 2-pin (single cross shaft) diff centre design is the weakest of all comparable 4x4s on the market, and has not been improved since 1948. In fact it was made weaker in ~1971 when LR switched from split-pin cross shaft retainment to circlips - the latter allowed the single cross shaft to rotate and oval the hole it sits in, wearing away the circlips in the process.

It is an inherently weak design, which everyone is strongly advised to upgrade to an LSD or similar - especially if they travel to remote areas.

Hi 29dinosaur

I was trying to point out, the circumstances that do break front diffs and didn't want to try and judge your driving abilities, that diff centre may have had a flaw from new, but a sudden shock load does weaken parts, setting them up for failure at a later date.

That weak single pin cross shaft design has been responsible for sale of more than a few Japanese four wheel drives for decades, maybe Land Rover wanted the Japanese 4WD's to dominate the market by leaving the design of the Defender's diff this way.

If you are preparing your Defender for extended trip in remote and difficult conditions, then it would be a wise move to fit after market, strengthened, diff centres or locking centres.
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