X Engineering Handbrake Conversion

There stoping ability is superior to a disc just not when hot. There's many other reasons why service brakes have been replaced with the disc stoping ability when cold is not one of them.

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Originally Posted by blackrangie

Ive got a mate running them, is the design stronger? So less likely to rip?

Also not saying anything about the handbrake drum denting, just dont like putting the whole weight of the car on it and ripping tranny mounts out :(

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They are bolted through solid lumps of steel with rubber inserts, so you need to tear the bolt out of the mount to break them.....which I have seen, but you won't be torturing your car enough:D

My handbrake was X eng, I though it was awseome....till it randomly decided to let go a few times;)

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Originally Posted by Lotz-A-Landies

But the application of the forces is different in a drum and a disk assembly. While a drum brake can be subject to accumulated oil leaking from the output shaft turning friction material into a bearing material.

Just compare the pad surface area on wheel disk brakes and the respective shoes on the drum brakes the disks replaced. No one would suggest drum brakes are superior to disks on the wheels.

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Fair comment

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Originally Posted by rovercare

They are bolted through solid lumps of steel with rubber inserts, so you need to tear the bolt out of the mount to break them.....which I have seen, but you won't be torturing your car enough:D

My handbrake was X eng, I though it was awseome....till it randomly decided to let go a few times;)

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Hahaha..maybe not,.but i did manage to rip the current ones out by boucing a foot in the air by a rock flicking out and landing the entire cars weight on the drum on a 1.5 meter sandstone vert ledge, so id much preffer it to land on the chassis or sill tanks..hmm maybe it wont be a big issue as ill be running sill tanks on the next truck. Which i think hang down a bit.

But thanks for the heads up with the qt mounts..any downsides of running them as tranny mounts over standard?

If they have ripped through the mounts then would it be a good idea to run nice thick/wide washers before the locknut?

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Originally Posted by Bearman

X brake brand and as I said it would slip easier than the standard drum one. Tried all sorts of adjustment ideas even changed pads but nothing improved it. I could even start off in 1st gear with it on. The main reason I bought it was because I use the County to launch a 3.5 ton Sharkcat at a local boat ramp and wasn't entirely happy with the standard drum type. The X brake was worse so I have gone back to the drum type.

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This is basically the same as my experience. I am about to change back. The pads are less than 1/3 worn and not oily, cable is at max adjustment (as are all other adjustments) and it won't hold on my driveway (or not enough to trust it anyway).

Great idea in theory...

In the IIA I have dragged the drum on rocks heaps of times with no damage. On the IIA and the 110 I have also never had a drum that I couldn't get to hold no-matter how oily it was.

Have you guys talked to X-eng? I've never used one, but every other forum says they hold very well. Is this the only honest forum or do brakes work differently in the southern hemisphere ;)?

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Originally Posted by Red90

Have you guys talked to X-eng? I've never used one, but every other forum says they hold very well. Is this the only honest forum or do brakes work differently in the southern hemisphere ;)?

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I talked to Simon a while back. The only suggestion he could offer was that something had become bent. He said that happens if you try and drive with the HB engaged (which in itself is concerning). I checked and I cannot find anything bent.

Bear in mind that 90% or so of UK landies are SWB, and numbers are the other way around here. I am sure that the X-brake offers advantages in rust-belt areas (especially compared to linkage systems).

A defining subject in differences between Disc rotor brakes and Drum brakes is that Drum brakes are partly self enrgising, as the shoes contact the drum surface a slight camming action occurs, this "draws" the shoe lining onto the drum surface. The problem with this in wheel drums is that heat generated can not dissipate easily.So heating of the shoes starts to negate the initial actions causing "Fade". But in a handbrake drum this camming action works to increase force if the drum attemps to rotate from stoped. this is why they tend to work better forwards than backwards.it is to do with the angle of contact.
A disc rotor works more on clamping forces and swept area. As the pads contact only a small area of the disc there is much more uncovered to cooling area and air. So are not so subject to "fading" However nearly all except some early disc brake systems are "power assisted" in 1 form or another to assist in generating the required clamping or braking forces.
This is probably why the disc handbrake is not such a success or is in general use among the motoring manufacturers .
If we could power assist the handbrake it would work better or maybe just increase the leverage with a longer arm?
Cheers Scott

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Originally Posted by schuy1

A defining subject in differences between Disc rotor brakes and Drum brakes is that Drum brakes are partly self enrgising, as the shoes contact the drum surface a slight camming action occurs, this "draws" the shoe lining onto the drum surface. The problem with this in wheel drums is that heat generated can not dissipate easily.So heating of the shoes starts to negate the initial actions causing "Fade". But in a handbrake drum this camming action works to increase force if the drum attemps to rotate from stoped. this is why they tend to work better forwards than backwards.it is to do with the angle of contact.
A disc rotor works more on clamping forces and swept area. As the pads contact only a small area of the disc there is much more uncovered to cooling area and air. So are not so subject to "fading" However nearly all except some early disc brake systems are "power assisted" in 1 form or another to assist in generating the required clamping or braking forces.
This is probably why the disc handbrake is not such a success or is in general use among the motoring manufacturers .
If we could power assist the handbrake it would work better or maybe just increase the leverage with a longer arm?
Cheers Scott

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This can't be true of transmission drum brakes because they are leading trailing shoes so should work the same in either direction.

Thanks Diana, my bad, yes you are correct, transmission drum shoes are leading /trailing! I seem to be thinking about handbrakes working off the rear drums as per early holdens and fords! :o They did not work so well and yes the hand brakes on my series and defender and disco do hold forwards and backwards although that may be just 'cause I keep them adjusted! and never trust them! :D Murphy s law about mechanical devices and all that!Cheers Scott