Thread: Increased power TD5's - what have you done to solve the MAF issues?

Just found this:

M.A.F.

Demon Land Rover TD5 MAF controller performance tuner . I'm not sure that it actually does what I'm trying to achieve though, I think it might do the opposite?

They seem to make their version of a turbo boost box for the MAP sensor called the Boost Demon which is a quiet neatly packaged to sit next to the sensor itself with the original wiring loom plugging straight in - Land Rover TD5 performance Pro Boost controller boost box and fueling adjustment

EDIT: there seems to be no purchase options or contact details on there site. Strange.

I just used the boost box with my hybrid turbo running 23 pounds.. no problems at all.

Originally Posted by SPROVER

I just used the boost box with my hybrid turbo running 23 pounds.. no problems at all.

That's great and I'm glad for you as it means you don't have this headache that has plagued me since 2010, but for this thread I'm interested in solutions from those that have actually done it. My vehicle does have problems from the MAF flow exceeding it's reading capabilities, they existed before with the standard turbo wound up, where still there when I fitted the Turbo Technics VGT and after four different ECU remap tunes and three different MAF sensors I figure the issue is here to stay unless I work around it...



Pete Bell of Bell Auto Services in the UK has suggested that i just run the standard Turbo Booster Box for the MAP sensor issue and then leave the MAF sensor disconnected so that the vehicle runs off default values to resolve the MAF issue. A bit crude but I imagine it will work. He also said:

duel channel box stops the maf tripping. We found its easier to raise its limit in the remap or disconnect it totally.

This really depends on whether it's a 10p or 15p engine. Here's my noddy understanding, someone like Offtrack would have much more detail:

10p the ecu doesn't throw a wobbler if the MAF flow goes out of scale - it's only used to calculate air flow difference between what the MAP is seeing so an estimation of EGR ingestion can be made.

15p the ecu will throw it's toys out because this is the primary method it uses to calculate air ingestion - so when the MAF reading goes out of scale it will cut fuel.

To get around this you can fool the ECU with bypasses or signal clamping, BUT, this is not a good idea because the ECU can no longer effectively control fueling.

The stock MAF can actually measure up to ~800kgh of flow but it becomes slightly less accurate at the upper reaches (one of the reasons that Land Rover decided to not use the upper reaches), tuners can re-calibrate the MAF lookup table to allow for airflows this high to be easily handled.

On a high boost engine this will still be exceeded, and can be countered by either:

a) retrofitting a larger flow capable MAF sensor and retuning accordingly - other problems then come into the mix, ie the diameter of the air intake system restricts flow compared to the MAF diameter so it's not certain if the measurement is accurate.

b) introducing a software clamp to the MAF table - effectively doing the same as a physical signal clamp, not a good idea imho as again the ECU is no longer fueling according to measurements.

But in short, the tune option is way preferable to the bypass/bodge the signal approach. Or retrofit a 10p

Jose at TD5inside advised:

there´s a maf adjuster that basically allows the maf to work within scales, bit like turbo boost box but for the maf.

Shipped should be roughly 225 AUD

Originally Posted by BennehBoy

This really depends on whether it's a 10p or 15p engine. Here's my noddy understanding, someone like Offtrack would have much more

Fairly confident it is a 15P being a Late 2002 built D2a. Has the later version of the FPR with the extra external hose. I'll get back to Jose at TD5Inside then about modifying the tune for the MAF to see if that is a viable option.

IMHO altering the signal from the MAF with a bit of hardware is not the correct way to go, but I can understand why tuners would do it... the hardware is really cheap to produce (zener diode) and has a high mark up, the effect of the issue goes away. In real terms the difference from the ECU perspective may be marginal, but it's still not able to calculate air mass correctly once that HW is introduced. Maybe not a problem if the tune being used is injection timing based, but deffo a problem if it's AFR based.

I have got a 15p Defender with a VNT upgraded intercooler it runs up to 24-25 psi I have never had this issue
To be honest I don’t know why
I have a snorkel I know this restricts things slightly maybe this is the reason
You can adjust the map to change the scaling slightly this improves it I just have never had reason to

My MAP and MAF ECU scales were adjusted by someone who shall remain nameless because he asked to be.2002 15P.
My boost goes to 21PSI without problems and my drivability is excellent.
Haven't tried more but think I am pretty much at the limits.
Have never had a overboost shutdown.
I too have a snorkel .

Regards Philip A