Series 1 weight - how much and how to reduce temporarily

**weeds** · 27th September 2018, 06:38 AM

Originally Posted by Homestar

So that's the whole point - if there is no documentation, how is it not legal? If I got pulled up towing a 3000kg caravan with my old HQ I'd be asking them to show me the regulation that says what I'm doing is illegal. That's what is required in a court of law and why new laws are made all the time - to close loopholes where no laws exist because someones doen something that is percieved to be wrong but when tested, found there isn't a law to prohibit it. If it doesn't expessly say you can't do it, then you can...

It’s doesn’t really bother me...as I’m not in your position. My zero comment was tongue in cheek

Series 1 weight - how much and how to reduce temporarily

by continuing to post indicates this as well.

have you taken it up with your local authorities.

I found some references for QLD, I’d be happy complying with what they have posted. Pretty sure inspectors and police in QLD would recognize it.

**Homestar** · 27th September 2018, 06:40 AM

All good - While I was writing that last bit out you'd provided documentation - which I'd never been able to find, so I deleted my post. 👍😊

I'm not actually in the position myself - all my vehicles including the 101 have specified towing limits and GCM so I know what I can and can't tow legally, but it's a minefield out there of hearsay and half truths.

Most people just say 'it is this' without any proof so it's always good when actual documentation is found. 👍

**Mick_Marsh** · 27th September 2018, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by weeds

I think the article I was reading was referring to tow bars...from 1988 they have to have a rating on them.

I don’t doubt there isn’t a reference document, if there was you guys would telling us.....

And there have been a few people fitting towbars to their Perenties that are rated to 3.5t.
This would mean, after reading what is being discussed here, those Perenties can legally tow 3.5t.

Thanks for the link, weeds.

**weeds** · 27th September 2018, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by Mick_Marsh

And there have been a few people fitting towbars to their Perenties that are rated to 3.5t.
This would mean, after reading what is being discussed here, those Perenties can legally tow 3.5t.

Thanks for the link, weeds.

In QLD at least....

**Homestar** · 27th September 2018, 07:53 AM

Getting closer Mick - while this is just a website it has an interesting introduction stated that in December 1998 all State's Ministers of Transport agreed on national towing regulations. Further down it says the same as Weeds posted - 1.5 times the unladen weight of the vehicle if nothing is specified by the manufacturer.

Just need to find the actual Victorian reg that states this now...

national australian towing regulations

**mick88** · 27th September 2018, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Homestar

Getting closer Mick - while this is just a website it has an interesting introduction stated that in December 1998 all State's Ministers of Transport agreed on national towing regulations. Further down it says the same as Weeds posted - 1.5 times the unladen weight of the vehicle if nothing is specified by the manufacturer.

Just need to find the actual Victorian reg that states this now...

national australian towing regulations

Good to see something else in writing.
1.5 times the vehicles unladen weight is a reasonably generous figure.
The old "rule of thumb" is out the door, where it is/was thought best if the towing vehicle is heavier than what it is towing.

Cheers, Mick.

**cjc_td5** · 27th September 2018, 09:24 AM

Taken from WA DoT website.
https://www.transport.wa.gov.au/medi..._VS_IB_107.pdf

"...If the vehicle's towing capacity cannot be determined, the loaded mass of the trailer must
not exceed the empty mass (tare) of the towing vehicle, excepting where the trailer is
fitted with brakes in which case the loaded mass of the trailer must not exceed 1.5 times
the empty mass of the towing vehicle..."

A 6x6 Perentie project just got a bit more feasible.....

Cheers,
Chris

**JDNSW** · 27th September 2018, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Homestar

Getting closer Mick - while this is just a website it has an interesting introduction stated that in December 1998 all State's Ministers of Transport agreed on national towing regulations. Further down it says the same as Weeds posted - 1.5 times the unladen weight of the vehicle if nothing is specified by the manufacturer.

Just need to find the actual Victorian reg that states this now...

national australian towing regulations

Just because the Ministers agreed to national regulations does not mean that all (or indeed any!) states and territories implemented them (either at all or unchanged). The rules governing motoring in this country are littered with examples.

**Homestar** · 27th September 2018, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by JDNSW

Just because the Ministers agreed to national regulations does not mean that all (or indeed any!) states and territories implemented them (either at all or unchanged). The rules governing motoring in this country are littered with examples.

Absolutely agree which is why I want to find the actual legislation should it exist. Looks like Qld and WA have formalised this, but can't find anything for Vic yet. Have emailed Vicroads but I'm not hopeful for an answer.

**Homestar** · 1st October 2018, 09:11 AM

Well, what do you know - Vicroads replied to my inquiry. Will see if I can find the regs now as they've got all that info there. SO - if the Perenties don't have an OEM specified towing rating, using a braked trailer - 1.5 times the tare mass. Note this is for LIGHT vehicles only - up to 4.5 tonnes GVM, so this won't apply to the 6x6 variant.

"Hello Gavin,
The Road Safety Vehicle Regulations 2009 S.R. No. 118/2009, Part 4.1 Regulation163 has the following information on towing for light vehicles:

ROAD SAFETY (VEHICLES) REGULATIONS 2009 - REG 163
Mass limit for trailers being towed by light motor vehicles
(1) The total mass limit for a trailer, including any load, being towed by alight motor vehicle is the lowest of the following-
(a) the capacity of the towing apparatus fitted to the motor vehicle;
(b) the maximum trailer mass specified by the light motor vehicle's manufacturer for trailers that may be towed by the light motor vehicle;
(c) the GVM of the trailer.
(2) If the manufacturer of a light motor vehicle has not specified a maximum trailer mass for trailers that may be towed by the light motor vehicle, or it cannot be identified, the following is to be taken to be the light motor vehicle manufacturer's limit for the purposes of sub regulation (1)-
(a) if the trailer is fitted with brakes, one and half times the unladen mass of the motor vehicle; or
(b) if the trailer is not fitted with brakes, the unladen mass of the motor vehicle

Regards,
VicRoads Vehicle Safety & Registration Services

NOTE: Please do not reply to this email as the mailbox is unattended."

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