Thread: CW&P ratios and other things

I've chosen 4.11s, Hi-Tough axles early RR CVs (Fusible link) in rover housings to keep clearance on 35s. Not that cheap or strong but simple + I'm a bit of a purist. Lolux/80series in Rover centres with J Mack axles etc would be my next choice followed by 80 series complete diff swap.

411s on 35s should be similar in gearing to 3.54 on stock tyres.

Tony

Originally Posted by Rangier Rover

I've chosen 4.11s, Hy-Tough axles early RR CVs (Fusible link) in rover housings to keep clearance on 35s. Not that cheap or strong but simple + I'm a bit of a purist. Lolux/80series in Rover centres with J Mack axles etc would be my next choice followed by 80 series complete diff swap.

411s on 35s should be similar in gearing to 3.54 on stock tyres.

Tony

Tony

I have heard a few people say they keep the factory CVs as a built in weak point. I understand they are cheap to replace. Wouldnt you be better off with ashcrost CVs though...expensive but they shouldnt break and if you upgrade the axles etc, neither should they.

Angus

Originally Posted by McDisco

Tony

I have heard a few people say they keep the factory CVs as a built in weak point. I understand they are cheap to replace. Wouldnt you be better off with ashcrost CVs though...expensive but they shouldnt break and if you upgrade the axles etc, neither should they.

Angus

AEU2522 CVs County type are strongest ashcroft make an up graded version of them. Problem is when they do break they explode and take axle with them. Over 1k in damage Rangie 10spline stubs cost around $15 and take 10mins to change. If its a comp truck and have the $$ go the ashcroft.
If just a hardarse tourer and a bit of fun 606665 CVs are OK.
They say once you break a few you only have to adjust your driving style a bit.

Yeah its just a weekend toy. I have the D2 for touring and longer camping trips...I want a rangie to treat rougher and to trying harder stuff with. I dont think I will need the ashcroft CVs...your plan sounds good with the fusible link.

Angus

Originally Posted by McDisco

Hey All

Just doing some research in preparation for buying my rangie and I was just wanting to know a bit more about replacement Cw&P gears. It looks like most people go for 4.11's but you can get 4.27's, 4.75's etc.

Correct me if Im wrong, but 4.11's will still be a little tall for a rangie which will mean revs at 100km/hr will be lower giving good mileage, but it will mean less power. I am setting the rangie up as a weekend toy so offroad ability is a priority and being in eastern Melbourne its not that far to all the good spots anyway.

So if I am fitting 35's would I be best getting higher ratio gears? This would compensate for not changing the transfer case gears so that low 1st would be lower right?

And can someone clarify something else for me? When people talk about putting in Toyota centres are we talking about the spider gears or the CW&P? And does the Jac Mac 6 pinion carrier replace these parts or am I totally on the wrong line?

Am currently weighing up whether I go through jacmac for diff locks, axles, CW&P or whether I would go through with ARB difflocks, hytuff axles, and ashcroft CW&P. Any comments on which is a better setup? They end up costing about the same...

Angus

Hi Angus,

The 4.3 ratios will return a RRC back to standard gearing with 35's. I doubt you'll find that ratio in Rover, or a spare when it breaks. Toyota Hilux you can get these in, and there are currently 2 for sale on Outers. The Toyota Hilux diff conversion is pulling the entire Rover 3rd member (diff assembly) out of the axle housing and replacing the complete unit with a Toyota one. You'll need some drilling etc to match the bolt patterns, but from being in Andrew e's buggy, this is a reeeeeeeeeally strong setup, even flat stick with fat 36" IROKs into banks on a side angle. The axle half shafts wont match the Rover ones, so you can either run toyota sized axles or if you run a JM diff have him make it with rover side. Even Maxi and JM axles will break though.

I'm not a believer in designing in weak points - I think that you should build cars so that they dont break at all for how you use them. If you're building it for 35's and sensible play then you'll still break county CV's. The Ashcrofts for Rover diffs wont break - the diff is the fuse and you can break Rover diffs also if you go nuts with it. If you run the Toyota diffs then you'll have a lot more strength, and you can run Longfield axles/CV's to suit from Keith (Revor) on here for a setup that wont break. Some change to Nissan GQ front axles for a big diff and strong axles - but the CV's are still not strong. That gets matched to a Cruiser 80 rear axle and the ratios are also pretty much 4.1, though can swap and change ($$) to 4.3. The Toy setup is Landcruiser 80 or 100 front diff into the front, and Hilux 4.1 or 4.3 in the rear. The JM 6 gear centre is basically a locker diff without the locker. It replaces the hemisphere, which is the big spinning thing that the crownwheel bolts to.

If you're calculating:
4.1's, lockers, Hytuff rear axles, Ashcroft front axles + CVs.

If you're carefree:
Toyota LC100 4.3 HP front diff + ARB locker, Rovertracks axles/CV's etc to suit, rear Hilux 4.3 rear diff with ARB locker, Rovertracks 31 spline axles + flanges

All of the above vendors have reputations for good customer service.

Originally Posted by Slunnie

Hi Angus,

The 4.3 ratios will return a RRC back to standard gearing with 35's. I doubt you'll find that ratio in Rover, or a spare when it breaks. Toyota Hilux you can get these in, and there are currently 2 for sale on Outers. The Toyota Hilux diff conversion is pulling the entire Rover 3rd member (diff assembly) out of the axle housing and replacing the complete unit with a Toyota one. You'll need some drilling etc to match the bolt patterns, but from being in Andrew e's buggy, this is a reeeeeeeeeally strong setup, even flat stick with fat 36" IROKs into banks on a side angle. The axle half shafts wont match the Rover ones, so you can either run toyota sized axles or if you run a JM diff have him make it with rover side. Even Maxi and JM axles will break though.

I'm not a believer in designing in weak points - I think that you should build cars so that they dont break at all for how you use them. If you're building it for 35's and sensible play then you'll still break county CV's. The Ashcrofts for Rover diffs wont break - the diff is the fuse and you can break Rover diffs also if you go nuts with it. If you run the Toyota diffs then you'll have a lot more strength, and you can run Longfield axles/CV's to suit from Keith (Revor) on here for a setup that wont break. Some change to Nissan GQ front axles for a big diff and strong axles - but the CV's are still not strong. That gets matched to a Cruiser 80 rear axle and the ratios are also pretty much 4.1, though can swap and change ($$) to 4.3. The Toy setup is Landcruiser 80 or 100 front diff into the front, and Hilux 4.1 or 4.3 in the rear. The JM 6 gear centre is basically a locker diff without the locker. It replaces the hemisphere, which is the big spinning thing that the crownwheel bolts to.

If you're calculating:
4.1's, lockers, Hytuff rear axles, Ashcroft front axles + CVs.

If you're carefree:
Toyota LC100 4.3 HP front diff + ARB locker, Rovertracks axles/CV's etc to suit, rear Hilux 4.3 rear diff with ARB locker, Rovertracks 31 spline axles + flanges

All of the above vendors have reputations for good customer service.

Thanks mate....now Im even more confused. I think I need someone just to tell me what to get. I want something reasonably priced and strong. Cause I can add everything else onto it later I want to get the driveline sorted first up.

If you were doing it, what would you do?

Angus

Originally Posted by McDisco

Thanks mate....now Im even more confused. I think I need someone just to tell me what to get. I want something reasonably priced and strong. Cause I can add everything else onto it later I want to get the driveline sorted first up.

If you were doing it, what would you do?

Angus

I think that building a driveline is never going to be cheap. If its done by parts, then the parts are expensive. If its done by swapping, then you need to get fabrication and adaption done - which is expensive. You also need to factor in rear lower links - I've seen heaps of these bend.

I'm going to assume you're regearing to suit.

If you are regearing, locking, reaxling + CVing in one hit, then I would run LC front diff (4.1 or 4.3), Hilux rear diff (4.1 or 4.3), Rovertracks axles F+R and CVs etc. You'll save $1000 - $1300 buy not buying Rover CW/P's and the rest is similar in cost (check this though) and heaps stronger. You will need to fit the Toyota centres to the axles - there are a few writups on this on Outers.... and actually, I think Andy e may have a set which are already to go from his chnging over to Mog diffs. You'll also need to change your tailshaft ends to suit or machine the pinion flange to suit.

If you drive with mechanical empathy and want to build the driveline slowly, then I'd do Rover - but tracks like what we did in Toolangi or where ever they where that are really loose, climbing and bouncy are jut Rover diff failures waiting to happen.

For me - I've put entire LC60 axles under my Series Landy as with lockers and Lonfields they will be pretty much unbreakable in that car. Big diffs and strong CV's, but the LC60s are too narrow for RRC's. My series landy is built to drive care free and without breakage.

Originally Posted by Slunnie

I think that building a driveline is never going to be cheap. If its done by parts, then the parts are expensive. If its done by swapping, then you need to get fabrication and adaption done - which is expensive. You also need to factor in rear lower links - I've seen heaps of these bend.

I'm going to assume you're regearing to suit.

If you are regearing, locking, reaxling + CVing in one hit, then I would run LC front diff (4.1 or 4.3), Hilux rear diff (4.1 or 4.3), Rovertracks axles F+R and CVs etc. You'll save $1000 - $1300 buy not buying Rover CW/P's and the rest is similar in cost (check this though) and heaps stronger. You will need to fit the Toyota centres to the axles - there are a few writups on this on Outers.... and actually, I think Andy e may have a set which are already to go from his chnging over to Mog diffs. You'll also need to change your tailshaft ends to suit or machine the pinion flange to suit.

If you drive with mechanical empathy and want to build the driveline slowly, then I'd do Rover - but tracks like what we did in Toolangi or where ever they where that are really loose, climbing and bouncy are jut Rover diff failures waiting to happen.

For me - I've put entire LC60 axles under my Series Landy as with lockers and Lonfields they will be pretty much unbreakable in that car. Big diffs and strong CV's, but the LC60s are too narrow for RRC's. My series landy is built to drive care free and without breakage.

LC 60 are bloody strong for sure. Slunnie I do like the blue series. The only thing that may break is the cart springs or the driver if driven in anger.

If I had the time I would have used Tojo centers in the Rover housings. BEST OF BOTH WORLDS. I will have to drive mine to suit its strength. They will take a bit though.